Comments on: About Last Night ….

By: Tiffany

Tiffany — Thu, 07 Aug 2008 16:45:14 +0000

I’ll be happy to excuse your ignorance; your arrogance not so much.

And, no, it’s not that Heilman is great; it’s that blown saves is a bogus stat for set-up men.

By: Ray Sadecki

Ray Sadecki — Thu, 07 Aug 2008 16:32:22 +0000

Your right, Tiffany. Heilman is great. Please excuse me.

By: Tiffany

Tiffany — Thu, 07 Aug 2008 12:18:37 +0000

I just checked on some numbers for set-up men.

Okajima is 1 for 8 in converting save opportunities this year. Romero is 1 for 5. McClellan is 0 for 4. Qualls is 2 for 8. Pena is 1 for 4.

For his career, Broxton is 10 for 23.

It’s a very misleading stat when applied to middle relievers, as they get tagged for the blown save when they fail, without ever getting credit for the save when they succeed.

By: Tiffany

Tiffany — Thu, 07 Aug 2008 11:53:45 +0000

It is what it is? So, then, you’re content to be equally deceptive and inappropriate?

By: Ray Sadecki

Ray Sadecki — Thu, 07 Aug 2008 10:50:55 +0000

Upon further investigation, its interesting to note that heilman has finished 78 games in his career, including 16 this year. Once again, despite there being over 20 different stats listed, there is none for blown hold.

By: Ray Sadecki

Ray Sadecki — Thu, 07 Aug 2008 10:40:26 +0000

It is what it is. I went to Heilmans stats on nymets.com and its right there in orange and white. 6 saves in 19 save opportunities. Yes I dont like the writer, but as John Adams once said ” facts are stubborn things.”

By: Tiffany

Tiffany — Thu, 07 Aug 2008 09:06:28 +0000

The stat is misleading when applied to set-up men; you’ve admitted that it’s reflective of the writer’s ignorance; and yet you still cite the writer. What am I missing?

By: Ray Sadecki

Ray Sadecki — Thu, 07 Aug 2008 03:23:49 +0000

Because sometimes he points out things that other writers dont. Thats why Mets fans all hate him. Sometimes the truth hurts. He didnt have to dig up that statistic to let us know Heilman melts under pressure. The stat only helps to underscore it. By the way, theres no such thing as a blown hold, so it can only be a blown save.

By: Tiffany

Tiffany — Thu, 07 Aug 2008 02:07:43 +0000

So, then, why are you citing him when you admit he’s ignorant?

By: Ray Sadecki

Ray Sadecki — Thu, 07 Aug 2008 01:40:37 +0000

Wallys main purpose in life is to make the mets look bad, so im sure its the former.

By: Tiffany

Tiffany — Thu, 07 Aug 2008 00:52:17 +0000

Wally is either ignorant or purposefully misleading. I’m not sure it matters which one, though.

By: Ray Sadecki

Ray Sadecki — Thu, 07 Aug 2008 00:09:26 +0000

I was waiting for your snappy comeback. Thats the rule. We all know that Wagner is the closer, but wally took a liberty and he is tecnically right. I can still remember a time when closers came on in the 7th inning and closed it out. Just because it rarely happens now, does not change the rule.

By: Tiffany

Tiffany — Wed, 06 Aug 2008 23:53:04 +0000

Oh, I get it…so, when Heilman was being used in the 6th, 7th and 8th innings, the Mets were planning on having him finish each of those games? Good point. Better run it by Wagner, though.

By: Ray Sadecki

Ray Sadecki — Wed, 06 Aug 2008 23:02:06 +0000

Tiffany, A save can for one inning of work or 3 or 4 or 8 innings. The rule is his team has a 3 run lead or less, he qualifies for a save. If the relief pitcher pitches more than 3 innings, he can still get credit for a save even if his team is leading by more than 3 runs. Of course, He has to be the one to finish the game to qualify, so technically, and leave it to wally to find a way to make the numbers look as bad as possible, his stat could be correct.

By: Tiffany

Tiffany — Wed, 06 Aug 2008 21:52:26 +0000

2005: 5 for 6
2006: 26 for 31
2007: 22 for 27
2008: 13 for 15

Based on this, I would imagine that Heilman’s real problem has been in tie games (which don’t count as holds or blown saves).

By: Steve (The Original)

Steve (The Original) — Wed, 06 Aug 2008 21:04:57 +0000

Good call Tiffany. However, it still sucks as i’m sure the 13 blown holds were probably within the past year and a half.

By: Tiffany

Tiffany — Wed, 06 Aug 2008 20:47:56 +0000

I checked on this, and every single one of these 13 blown saves occurred as a set-up man; i.e., it was Heilman coughing up a lead in the 6th, 7th or 8th innings—not when closing in the 9th. As a 9th-inning closer, Heilman has never blown a save in his career.

The appropriate stat for a set-up man is holds. Heilman has 66 holds in 79 opportunities over his career.

By: Ray Sadecki

Ray Sadecki — Wed, 06 Aug 2008 19:53:18 +0000

As I posted in the last thread, Heilman is 6 for 19 in save chances. You cant run him out there again. The mets were fortunate to come away with a win last night and they cant afford to give any games away at this point. The only answer is kunz. Lets hope he is ready.

By: Jimmy dean

Jimmy dean — Wed, 06 Aug 2008 19:51:04 +0000

Free Eddie Kunz!!! I think Mets management fears that if he comes in and gets a big save that he will run around down the rightfield line and start slapping five with all the fans ala a former #44. It’s the number they fear, that’s the problem. Change your number Ed and you will get a chance to close.

By: JohnM

JohnM — Wed, 06 Aug 2008 19:45:56 +0000

If they put Kunz in as closer he better succeed or he may get stuck with the worst nickname ever by the fans.