Mets Chat Room: Home Sweet Home edition
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- June
- 10
First pitch is less than an hour. When is the over/under if the inning when the booing starts?
Moises Alou is back. A lot of Mets say he could be a difference. That’s scary in a way that they depend so much on a 41-year-old injury-prone player who won’t be here next year.
They need John Maine to go long tonight and keep the offense from falling into a hole.
Talk with you later. JD
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on Tuesday, June 10th, 2008 at 6:14 pm by John Delcos.
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JD –
We all know that the Mets suck… so, I’m really not sure what these negative posts are supposed to do. Granted, all of these blog entries are spot on about how sad the mets are reliant on old players, but it’s not the readers of this blog that need to be made aware of that. We suck – I think everyone here is painfully aware of that and has come to grips with that.
I’d venture to guess that anyone reading this blog and taking the time to post is a die-hard mets fan, who is genuinely upset about this season.
I’d settle for just seeing some fun games from here on out (and the Phillies not making the playoffs). My expectations are minimal…
Uh-oh.
Maine’s falling behind hitters and running up his pitch count.
Is it just me, or is Delgado hitting the best he has since ‘06? He hit .410 on the road trip and has been raking with authority.
Gotta keep giving Delgado the new Folger’s…
John Maine is sneaky fast.
Bomb!!!! DW has some serious power.
Did I hear that right—that the Mariners have hired Lee Elias as their hitting coach?
They oughta go and get a (expletive) job and find out what it’s like to go out and earn a (expletive) living. Eight-five percent of the (expletive) world is working. The other 15 percent come out here. A (expletive) playground for the (expletive).
Tiffany, ?????
Why did Seaver get run out of town?
71 pitches in 3 innings for Maine which is just awful…
There’s some (expletive) pros out there that wanna win. But you’re stuck in a (expletive) stigma of the (expletive) Dodgers and the Phillies and the Cardinals and all that cheap (expletive). It’s unbelievable. It really is. It’s a disheartening (expletive) situation that we’re in right now.
Daily News columnist Dick Young, whose son-in-law worked for the Mets, was largely responsible for running Seaver out of town in 1977.
I think Maine will retaliate for Alou getting hit…just a hunch. I expect benches to clear…
I’m predicting that Pedro Borbon will chew a Met hat in half.
They have to pitch to Chavez here; if not, then they’ll have to deal with Nunez.
this is sickening. i have truley lost my appetite. living out in arizona, i’m going to have to take a lot of crap for this.
seriously, when a team loses 7 games in a row, which the mets will have done by thursday, a good gm or owner will fire the manager because he is clearly incompetent.
I see that former Met, Jon Matlack will be trying to straighten out Dontrell Willis down in Single A for the Tigers. I hope he’s more successful at these type of things than the “Jacket.”
6 innings from alou. Maybe he should be a starting pitcher vice left fielder.
September never ends….....
Turn out the lights … -JD
Moises Alou removed for precautionary reasons.
John Maine throws a ton of pitches and can’t win.
Three Mets relievers combine to turn a two-run lead into a four-run deficit.
Hitters wilt in the face of the opposing bullpen.
Same stuff, different game.
Our Mets are on the fast track to oblivion.
Willie must go
I just got in, check the box score because I refuse to watch this team anymore, gives me diarrhea. It appears to be last september, it’s not going away anytime soon. Why, because this team is not a good team. I’m over it though, I just hope Omar doesn’t do anything stupid and trade young prospects to try and fix this team because it won’t work. This team needs more than a quick fix. Omar is better off riding out the season and taking care of this in the off season.
I will say if Omar does make a move the most logical move at this point would be to fire Willie and Peterson, probably the whole coaching staff.
agee: I ask you, as I’ve asked everyone else who wants Willie Randolph fired: How is what’s happened in these last five games Willie’s fault?
*Did Willie hit three batters in an inning, as Mets pitchers did in San Diego?
*Did Willie arrange for the Mets to score three runs in the first 28 innings of a four-game series?
*Did Willie allow 10 hits in five innings on Sunday?
*Did Willie misjudge a popup Sunday that ignited a come from behind rally against us?
*Did Willie have the bullpen blow Sunday’s game?
*Is it Willie’s fault that the team’s most productive and consistent player injured himself and was foolishly not put on the disabled list?
*Is it Willie’s fault that the best pure hitter on the team as played only 16 games this season because of injury?
*Is it Willie’s fault that he has few bench options to turn to?
None of the above involves incompetence on the manager’s part. It’s a combination of the way the roster has been assembled, bad luck and a general lack of execution on the team’s part.
What manager do you know of would be able to right this sinking ship?
Please Omar just wait for the phone to ring and sell, sell low, just sell, as many as you can and then go away and leave the mess to the next GM. Bonilla/Coleman/Saberhagen = Delagado/Alou/Wagner. Different decade, same old crap.
PS: You all can sub any name of any bum on either team that makes you happy.
Gil in Savannah, GA,
I totally agree with you. I don’t care what manager Omar brings in it won’t matter. This team is just not a good team. To me, I blame Omar Minaya for building this team. Omar built it for a run year run and that ship has sailed.
Omar, Omar, Omar. Why would anyone want this guy to have the right to make any more decisions regarding this club? Fred Wilpon knows a bit about baseball right? What must be going through his mind? Certainly he is very involved with the new stadium, but even a casual observer can see what a total mess this has become. Our big league club is bad and if possible getting worse. Our minor league system is seemingly barren. Where the heck do we go from here?
I know I’ve been venting on this blog and apparently have pissed off a few bloggers but this is extremely embarrassing as a met fan to watch a team that has a payroll of 137 mil that is three games under .500, that is brutal. I just can’t seem to understand why met fans think this is willie’s fault either but hey, fire willie. If Omar is willing to fire willie than the whole coaching staff needs to go. It won’t change a thing IMO.
paulunde: Where do we go from here you ask. we anxiously await the start of training camps in July.
One more thing. John nailed it right from his opening comments tonight. This team needed John Maine to go deep into the game. Once again, Maine has let us down. With Oliver Perez being such a stiff, I think it has shifted a lot of negative attention away from John Maine.
I had such high hopes for this guy. He has shown us so many good signs early in his career. I am now starting to wonder though. Since the middle of last season he has been ordinary at best. He seems to mirror the progress – or decline, of the Mets. I was hoping he’d be a really solid #2-type starter for us. But the way he’s regressed over the past 12 months, he’s become a #4 starter in my mind. (More solid work by the Jacket!)
“Where the heck do we go from here?”
Staight to the s@@t box, future doesn’t look good. Wilpons need to wake up!!!!!!
tomg: If I could email you a bottle of Pepto for your Mets-induced diarrhea, I would. I went to two of the games in San Diego and the Mets gave me and about 25 percent of the crowd that was cheering for the Mets very little to cheer about.
You’re right. This is a below average team—at least right now. The only reason I say that is what happened in 2005 with the Astros—not the 2003 Marlins, because the current Mets don’t have that team’s talent.
While most of Omar’s moves worked early on, it appears you’re right, that retooling should’ve happened immediately after the magical 2006 season.
If this is where the Mets stand come the first week after the All-Star break, Omar must seriously consider having a fire sale for any takers.
This is suddenly feeling like 2003, with Rey Sanchez giving clubhouse haircuts during games, Roberto Alomar and Roger Cedeno fighting with each other in the dugout, with Fat Albert—er, Mo Vaughn—separating them.
Tomg – You’re exactly correct. Fire Willie if you like. He’s a weak manager. But the problems here go higher up than Willie. I think its time Omar is forced to answer for this mess. Lets see him on the hot seat like Willie was a couple of weeks back.
I myself have had it with peterson. He convinced jeff wilpon that kazmir would never be good. How is that looking now. Didn’t like Heath Bell, how does that look now. Probably had something to do with bannister getting traded. Peterson needs to go before willie goes, that I do know.
Fire Willie!!!!! He’ll be better off to get away from this team. Bring back Steve Phillips. Bring back Jeff Torborg… Bring back Trachsel. He just got DFAd. Bring back Butch Huskey…. Just get rid of this entire rotten outfit.
well,
fellow met fans. It’s time to say goodnight. Keep your heads up because it’s better than having them up your bleeps like our mets and there fearless leader Omar Minaya.
paulunde: Much as I agree that IF Willie were to be fired, it’d only be fair if the entire coaching staff was sacked, too, that’ll never happen in the middle of the season. No way. It’d have to be after this season, as it’d be damned hard to replace the manager and all the coaches to run the show on the field. That’d be complete chaos.
Gil-
I am in agreement. Firing Willie will not be the answer. Willie is not a very good manager, but he is not the main culprit here. Omar Minaya is the guilty party. He has been beyond reproach it seems for too long a time.
I have a feeling we are all coming around to the same opinion. I would not be surprised to see the New York Press start to really come down hard on this guy. He does not deserve any more time in charge of this team. I’d much rather see him fired than Willie. We can get to Willi, Peterson, etc. afterwards. There’s plenty of time for that.
Like Willie I see a major positive. The club is no longer playing inconsistent baseball.
It’s not Randolph’s fault but he is not part of the solution. He’s basically impotent and is thusly irrelevant. This club needs a Clinical Psychologist as manager. :)
Willie and the coaching staff are only part of the problem, sure.
But they’re the easiest parts to get rid of.
Why not, at this point.
In 2007, the Mets team ranked second in batting average (.275), third in on-base percentage (.342) and seventh in slugging (.432).
In 2008, the Mets team ranks eleventh in BA, seventh in OBP and 13th in slugging.
Has the personnel changed so much to warrant this type of discrepancy?
Abraham Nunez was DFA’d? This must mean the return of the Stache is imminent.
Tiff, correct.
Valentin as player-manager ala Joe Torre…..but let’s hope this team is not to become 1977-82…..ugh
Maybe Stache can also take over Omar’s job. He bascially does that, manage and play for w/his PR team.
After last night’s game, I join in the parade to change manager. The instant O Hudson made it 5-3, I knew they were going to lose (for no real reason) and if ever there was a game when the manger should have tried Lou Piniella, Ozzie Guillen theatrics last night, after Sunday, was the night. He could have gone nuts on the umps after stopping the game when Feliciano warmed up, instead of right ar the end of the 6th, he could have destroyed the press room or the food table. Instead the same old worn out line, just like the GOP worn out lines defending a worn out Presidency. I just don’t want to hear the same line for another 99 games afterwards.
The only bright spot that the Mets have of late is what they did not do. They did not re-sign Glavine (which they wanted to do), and, they did not trade the world for Dontrelle Willis (which they wanted to do). If we think that they are underperforming now, imagine what it would have been like with these two in the rotation this year!
Wake me up when and if this team puts a 10 game winning streak together. Guess i’ll be nice and refreshed before that happens.
THEGUYLOVESHTEMETS—-
I knew you’d come around, Fire everyone!!!!
THEGUYLOVESHTEMETS—-
I knew you’d come around, Fire everyone!!!!
J.S.Anybody here seen my old friend Delcos? Can you tell me where he’s gone?
Tiffany: He’s always been here. Hatin on the Mets as usual. :-)
Tiffany –
He’s out riding Wildfire…
Tiffany: I am here, sifting through the debris looking for the black box.-JD
JD: By the way, thank you for explaining to Tiffany for me that the Omar built this team to have to rely on players other than Reyes, Wright, and Beltran. :-)
Thank goodness for Euro 2008. It has been a welcome respite from this baseball season.
That’s not what I said, Steve. I said that, if the younger guys were pulling their weight the way they’re supposed to, we wouldn’t be focusing on the older guys.
I’ll go back to my earlier posting, in which I pointed out how the Mets have backslided away from last year’s league rankings—with practically the same personnel. How does that happen, Steve?
The roster has flaws and that is on Omar, for sure.
That being said, the reason this team is 30-33 on 6/11 is not directly because of Willie Randolph or Omar Minaya, it is because players are not producing.
-Santana has been fine…not great, but more than good enough.
-Maine has been inconsistent, but largely effective.
-Perez has taken a step back to his ‘05-06 days and that hurts
-Pedro has pitched in 3 games.
-The bullpen, outside of Wagner, Smith and Schoeneweis, has been spotty (albeit better of late, before last night)
-Delgado is done. He’ll have stretches, like now, where he bunches some hits together, but his power is gone…this is the Mets biggest mistake, IMO, relying on a bounce-back to ‘06-like levels.
-Beltran is playing like ‘05, though I think a lot has to do with the fact that he’s still recovering from two knee surgeries and has had NO ONE hitting behind him. Not to mention the fact that he’s not a cleanup hitter.
-Wright has been up-and-down
-Ditto for Reyes
-Castillo hasn’t been as bad as he’s been made out to be, but that 4-year deal was ludicrous.
-Church has been great.
-Schneider has done what he was expected to do.
-Alou can’t stay healthy…along with Delgado, the biggest fault with the Mets personnel moves…depending on him to stay on the field.
-Bench is ATROCIOUS and another big hit on Omar. What makes it worse are the club’s unbelievable roster moves thus far this season.
Now, there is some disconnect other than player performance. Except for a few players, this team is virtually the same as in ‘06 when they not only dominated, did so in a “family-like” fashion.
Declining players has something to do with that, but it doesn’t explain why a team that was as close as could be less than 2 years ago now seems to be a collection of talent and not a “team”
Mike—A friend of mine asked a good question recently. “Would the Mets have collapsed last September if Julio Franco were still on the team?”
You can talk all you want about how the guy was a wasted roster spot and could no longer turn on a fastball, but he did seem to provide a positive influence (e.g., talking Beltran into taking that curtain call) and, coincidentally or not, the team’s year-long funk seems to run parallel with his departure.
What if Franco were, in essence, providing a sort of managerial support that Willie has been unable to replicate? And what if certain players were upset with the old man’s dismissal and are holding a grudge against the manager responsible for it?
Honestly, I don’t buy this “team” theory. Baseball, while a contest between two teams, is very much an individual game. You don’t need these guys acting like frat brothers in order to win baseball games.
Even though I was initially in favor of hiring Willie, once I saw his managerial style in action, I have wanted him out of here. However, this past week I have changed my tune.
This mess is on Minaya. I don’t have a problem with taking a shot on guys like Alou and Delgado, but if that is your course of action then you need to have some kind of contingency plan in place. What is killing this team is that Alou, Church, and Pedro have all missed significant time. While Church’s injuries have been somewhat flukish, you had to expect Pedro and Alou would each have at least one 15 day DL stint each. So where are the contingency plans?
Minaya seems to have assembled this team with his fingers, toes, and shoelaces crossed hoping that all goes according to a precise plan. Any kind of deviation from that plan and the team not only underperforms, but they go bust. I think it is safe to say that the way Minaya has assembled not just the guys who play or even the 25 man roster, but the entire organization, in such a way that 2008 was going to be a boom or bust season. Right now, it looks like a bust.
The bottom line is we’ve seen way too much of guys like Angel Pagan and Endy Chavez paying everyday. When you’re already carrying Castillo, Schneider, and Delgado in your lineup, you can’t trot out a lineup with Endy in RF and Tatis in LF and expect to win baseball games.
The pitching staff is an entirely different story. I am so sick and tired of watching these guys nibble. Every freaking pitcher in this rotation throws in the low to mid 90s and all have good secondary pitches, with the exception of Pelfrey. They do not challenge hitters or some inside nearly enough. I know Peterson has a track record of keeping pitchers healthy, but I’ve really had enough of the nibbling.
You know what? I am just tired of all these guys. They need to clean house and get rid of Minaya and the entire coaching staff. When these guys were hired in ‘05 I was under the impression that everyone was on the same page philosophically and that we were going to make strides towards implementing an organization wide baseball philosophy similar to how the A’s, Braves, and even Yankees do things. Instead it seems like there is a disconnect between Minaya and Willie and also between Willie and Peterson.
So yeah, when this abomination of a season is over, let’s clean house and bring in a GM who will find a manager and coaching staff with similar baseball viewpoints so we can create some synergy in this organization.
Mike, I think you covered it all.
Keith-
Like I said…everyone is at fault to some point, but I still stand by my assertion that it’s a lack of productivity from the players which is the main culprit.
That being said, your point on Minaya is right on. Randolph is not a great in-game manager…but you know what, neither is Dusty Baker and he’s been a pretty successful manager everywhere he’s been.
Plus, with largely the SAME cast of characters back in ‘06 as there is now, I heard nothing but positives in the way Randolph handled the clubhouse…now all you hear is that he doesn’t “motivate” enough.
As this season has gone on, it’s become increasingly clear to me that the problem off the field is Minaya, not Randolph.
The team, although talented, is built very closely to a house of cards. Again, if key players (who are not old or washed up) were producing, this would be a moot point, but the fact that several players are being counted on (Delgado, Alou, Pedro) with no contingency plan in place has nothing to do with Randolph.
It’s Minaya’s fault and if he is not going to be let go, he needs to adapt to signing/trading/developing younger players and not playing checkbook baseball with aging players.
Tiffany- It’s a good question…but I must say, he was a waste of a roster spot in terms of productivity. He was fine in ‘06 but he was completely done last year.
I don’t know if they did this or not, but the Mets should have said to him, “we’re letting you go, but we’d like to have you on our coaching staff.”
I have no doubt he was a good influence in the clubhouse, but you can’t keep a guy on the roster who is completely washed up just for that reason. It’s the same reason I am torn on Valentin coming back.
He had basically a career-year in ‘06 but he also is a great clubhouse guy…but the Mets don’t need another middle infielder on his last legs on the roster.
Again…this is all on Omar for handing out ridiculous contracts.