Mets chatroom: Mets vs. Nats
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- May
- 12
A few minutes away from first pitch. Based on forecasts, I never thought this game would have been played. The weather woman I watched this morning made it seem like we were all in mortal danger with the storm that was coming. I don’t see a puddle anywhere. If I already didn’t have a job where I didn’t know what I was talking about, I’d become a meteorologist.
Now that this game will be played, the Mets will have to bring up a starter for Wednesday. Minaya said it will likely be somebody from New Orleans, and that most likely somebody will be Adam Bostick.
Since Matt Wise will eventually be activated and back in the bullpen, who should go down? Personally, I feel Luis Castillo’s quad will become a lingering issue and a stint on the DL is possible.
Joe Smith, Angel Pagan, and Endy Chavez are the candidates. Smith has allowed five earned runs and struck out 13 in 15 innings, so nobody wants to let go. Don’t forget he was this good last April and May before falling off. Pagan (.278) and Chavez (7 for 63) wouldn’t be missed.
Had Pagan not pinch-hit yesterday, he and his nagging shoulder could have gone on the DL, and been retro’d to the Dodgers series to buy some time.
In-game updates:
Second inning: Nelson Figueroa was reminded of what a bad fielder Carlos Delgado has become the Nationals tied the game at 1-1 because of it. Damion Easley just smacked a solo shot to center to put the Mets back up.
If you aren’t watching the game on TV, you missed five-tool star Lastings Milledge nearly made a fool of himself in center on Easley’s homer. He was difting toward the bleachers in left-center on a ball that went directly over the “410” sign in center. Had the ball hit off the wall, Milledge would have been a good 20-30 feet away from it.
As I write this, Ryan Church just lined a single to right. Right now, it’s his MVP to lose.
Third inning: Just checked the media guide. Here’s a little known fact about Nelson Figueroa: he hates pitching with a lead.
For the third inning in a row, he gave back the lead, this time on a horrendous throwing error. He did a nice job of knocking down Felipe Lopez’s grounder but air-mailed the throw to the plate.
The throw actually went through the batters box. Perhaps he was confused and thought there was someone batting. He’s already hit three guys.
Fifth inning: Figueroa is nearing 100 pitches and just gave up an RBI single to the opposing pitcher… and NOW somebody starts warming up in the pen.
Obviously, that person is Jorge Sosa, who is Figueroa’s personal reliever.
Sixth inning: The line on Jorge Sosa: 1 inn., 4 hits, 4 runs, 2 walks.
Would the Angels accept a trade of Matt Wise for Darren Oliver? The Mets clearly don’t need Wise and Sosa is miserable right now. Actually, Oliver hasn’t been quite as good as his 2006 season with the Mets, so I’m sure that won’t work. But it goes to show how valuable an innings-eating reliever can be. The Mets are now blown out of this game.
Eighth inning: Half of the 250 fans at Shea Stadium just broke for the exits after David Wright’s based loaded ground out ended that threat. It’s 10-4 in the ninth against one of the worst teams in baseball.
It leads me to a question: How cold does it have to be for some people to leave a game? There couldn’t have been more than a few thousand here at its highest point, which surprised me. Some people are still sticking around even now.
Be back after the game with any news/notes.
This entry was posted
on Monday, May 12th, 2008 at 6:58 pm by Kevin Devaney Jr..
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Hello? Is that an echo I hear? Hello? Good first inning for Nelson.
Yeah, Joe Smith was this good last April and May. Then, after Willie trotted him out in 29 of the team’s first 58 games, he was fried. I wonder how that happened. I mean, he had a whole season of pro experience in Brooklyn under his belt. Kid shoulda been fine, right Willie? Idiot.
I got on my score card the mets 1 and thanks to Delgado offensively and defensively 1.
Delgado didn’t make an error… Figueroa was still on the bag when he got the ball, the umps are just blind…
Delgado should be 7 spot. I heard he’s 6th/ and of course a hole in the lineup. when will they learn he only hits out of anger. put him in the 7 spot and leave him until he’s consistent. As it is He errors an important play.
Thank you easely for getting us the lead back!
I really love how Figueroa’s new schtick is to give leads back.
Two starts in a row now he’s pulling this garbage.
And I like Figueroa too…it’s a nice story and I think he can help this club. But they need to stick someone in the rotation who can start giving the team innings.
This is getting ridiculous with how high these guys pitch counts are running early on.
Nelson Figueroa is Brian Lawrence, except with a heart-warming story…
Josh,
I hope you were kidding because not only did delgado have the ball bounce off his glove initially he than threw the ball wide and that is what made figy miss the bag with his foot.
Between Figgy and Smellgado they make it really hard to keep leads.
3 plays now have you heard Keith about Delgado? The pregame. they all expected Delgado to bat 7th.
Mike,
this was the same problem last year and was the main reason the bull pen collaspe in september, they were fried.
Awesome…win or lose this game…get ready to see Jorge Sosa in the 5th or 6th inning, at the latest.
Why can’t these guy’s throwing godd*mn strikes?
tomg-I know…I actually expect it to improve because I don’t think Santana is going to be averaging just barely 6ip/start. Maine is already improving in that category…but the wild card is OP…he needs to start going into the seventh every now and then.
At the very least, complete six innings on a regular basis…it’ll do wonders in the long run.
The figgy story is nice but lets face it, he is another pitcher that the mets brought in because of injuries to there pitching staff that shouldn’t be pitching in the majors.
Figgy is fine if he’s left in a spot starter/long relief role. He can’t be expected to shoulder a start every five days.
Apparently Pedro should be nearing a return (for how long that will actually be, who knows), so his days are probably numbered…but with his last four starts plus Pelfrey’s inconsistency and Perez not being able to go past 6ip, it’s draining the bullpen big tim.
Interesting bio there, Kevin. What’s remarkable, though, is how much you look just like John Delcos. You must get stopped at restaurants, no?
Too negative for me. I’m out. You guys seem to love misery and seeing who can complain the most. Ever think about just sitting back and enjoying the game?
Later.
DC – Have fun.
The Gnats are a real classy bunch. razzing the picther??? real class.
Alou is hot. Figgy got the out.
1 step at a time :-)
Not watching Steve…what happened?
Don’t expect delgado to hit tonight, he looks terrible at the plate against Perez.
clm-No one’s complaining at all. Just stating facts…the Mets are having problems going deep into games, and it’s not just because their SPs have tough outings now and then.
These guys are routinely throwing 20 pitches/inning.
Well, this is ridiculous, Figy is not going to last much longer. If the Nats could actually hit the ball they would have 8 runs already.
clm-You don’t want to see complaining? Tell our team to not piss away leads in three consecutive innings.
Figueroa sucks… It’s obvious his first couple of starts were a fluke… We can’t keep using Nelson Figilawrence…..
clm,
let me try not to be negative here, figy is giving this game away to probably the worse team in the national league. If you can actually sit and watch this crap than Kudos to you.
Let’s see if the Mets learn from their mistakes of recent past. IE-cutting bait before it’s too late.
This is two straight bad starts for Figueroa and four straight subpar outings.
This is not 2006…they can’t afford to piss games away.
I’m following on gamecast and it said injury delay.
Did someone get hurt?
This is pathetic.
Why the heck did Figueroa give Flores anything to hit???
Oh that’s right, he can’t even get the pitcher out…
He better not get another start…
“Mike,
Did someone get hurt?”
Figy’s ego!!!
Are the Mets farting on ours faces again???
Hope they can somehow chip away and take this one (wishful thinking). If not, they BETTER win the next three, because a 4-3 homestand against this crap is completely unacceptable.
Agree completely. You have to go 5-2 against the Nats and Reds at home and it does not look promising.
11-5 against the bad teams (I saying the Marlins are a bad team…for now). 4 of the 5 the Mets have looked like they were sleep walking thru them.
I’m not on the whole “fire Willie” bandwagon (though he’s not exactly nearly endearing to me as he once was). That being said…why is Duaner Sanchez in here?
Here’s an idea…pitch Joe Smith…you know…Joe Smith? The guy has thrown to one batter in the last five days.
Just MIGHT want to save your setup guy for a situation when…he needs to actually SET UP a win.
scoopcoop,
“I saying the Marlins are a bad team…for now)”,
The Marlins have the best record in baseball, if that is bad I wish the Mets were that bad.
tomg- It is not going to last. They may be better than people thought they would, but their bullpen is atrocious and their rotation is being held together by Olsen/Hendrickson…that won’t last.
BTW, for the Willie-haters out there. I gotta tell you something. Just a feeling, but if this bullpen and some of the back-end guys (Pelfrey, in particular) don’t get going, the change you see come June 1 might be the dismissal of Peterson.
He needs to start taking some heat here.
1) why is it that the bullpen turns every close game NY is losing into a blowout
2) why are pitchers, from Johan on down, averaging 18 pitches/inning
3) nibble, nibble, nibble…is that what he teaches them?
The way things are going it could very well be Willie’s and Peterson’s last year with the mets.
Just show me some life and at least make the score respectable.
If they don’t roll over and die these last three innings, I’ll chalk this one up to Figueroa’s carriage turning into a pumpkin and Sosa being Sosa.
Even the sh*tty teams win some…so I’ll live with it, but they can’t just roll over and die here.
tomg-It could…but my point was this could end up being a 1999-type deal (when Phillips fired Tom Robson).
No matter how inconsistent this team is, I really can’t see them falling that far out by the end of May (and from what I’ve heard, that’s when the Wilpons are going to “assess” things).
If they are indeed still playing up and down yet in the same position standing-wise as they are now, it would be COMPLETELY un-Met like to fire Randolph and I don’t think they would.
IMO, the team would really need to be floundering for that to happen.
Peterson, OTOH, is another story….
If Joe Smith gets sent down…I’m going to be seriously upset with the regime of this team for the first time in a while.
Curious moves happen all the time with most teams, but if this guy gets the boot in favor of keeping Jorge Sosa because he can come in and pitch multiple innings all the while allowing 4 runs, I’m gonna be really pissed.
MATT WISE ALERT! MATT WISE ALERT!
Well, it doesn’t matter how bad Jorge Sosa pitched tonight, because it doesn’t seem like Matt Wise will be activated before Thursday. Wise had been sitting around the dugout since Friday, but with the Mets needing to activate a starter for Wednesday’s doubleheader, Wise’s return got pushed back.
Instead of the Wise continuing to warm the bench, the Mets sent him back to St. Lucie, where he appeared in a scoreless game and pitched a perfect 7th inning, striking out one. One day invisible man, one day.
I just hope the Mets get a good night sleep tonight to regain some energy to beat this last place team tomorrow. They were pretty busy last weekend and some of them seen tired tonight so I’m gonna let this lost slide.
You gotta just DFA Georgie Souser.
You… just GOTTA. It is the only sane call.
(Which means, of course, they won’t do it.)
A few tidbits, from my mind at least.
The game sucked, plain and simple. That being said, I really think this IS one of those games where Randolph can say, “you just turn the page.”
The offense continued to produce (four runs is not great, but 12 hits), Beltran looks to be back, Alou can hit no matter what the situation and Reyes had a nice night as well.
The problem was the pitching and truth be told, youc can’t expect much more out of Figueroa. Not saying it can continue and that he didn’t shoot himself in the foot tonight, but he is what he is, and that’s a swing-man/no. 5 starter.
The problem with this game, from top-to-bottom, is Jorge Sosa.
This man is the new Guillermo Mota. Comes in with a close game and proceeds to dump as much gasoline as their is in an airport’s pipeline onto a bonfire.
If this guy is still up here when Wise is activated, it will be a complete and utter farce. I don’t expect him or Smith to be sent down when Bostick comes up (unless they make two moves that day), but he has to go…now.
$2 million salary? Please…this team can afford that, no problem. Eat the godd*amn salary and cut his ass…he’s worthless.
Otherwise, just a bad loss and, IMO, not too much to look into. Need to come out and win tomorrow to get back on track. Maine going tomorrow…he’s 4-0 after Met losses.
I gave up the chat last night. As I watched the game and Bones and House. But it was terrible :-(
watching delgado not field , not hit. watching him make the final out. and just think if easley was batting next we could have had a shot.
:-(
But hey it wont stop. they may put him back at the 7 spot then he will hit well because of his ego then the next game back up the lineup and suck all over again. But hey what do i know…
This isnt the first time the mets pitching was below par. remember the 90’s? It isnt anything to get upset about. the issue is the fielding and the batting. If that isnt their then yes it plays to the bad pitching.
Oh well 3 more games in the series lets see what willie has learned.
Sometimes Steve C I almost think you are a Delgado stalker…
nah. my issue is I cant understand the spell he has everyone under. He is on this pedestal and for the life of me I cannot see why. Just like Al Leiter in the day. Bobby V loved him. I didnt think he was all that , at all. same think with Hampton (i think his name was)
It is a shame that Joe Smith is going to be getting the “Heath Bell” treatment of traveling back and forth between the parent club and triple. Sosa is not doing well, looks frustrated, and, is taking up a very needed spot on the roster. I would hope that the Mets would look to possibly move him, even for a minor leaguer or two,(or just ot move his contract) and then let Smith sink or swim with the Mets. Smith is still the first target to get set down even if the Mets deal Sosa, but, at least his performance so far warants him a little more time in the majors. The other thing that moving Sosa does is opens a spot on the 40 man roster for the Mets to either add Vargas or Armas should they need to without having to risk losing one of their other players.
Heath Bell, Turk wendell, and a host of others..
I just also noticed that in 33 at bats, Marlon Anderson has struck out 11 times… He has not impressed so far this year. With Delgado struggling, the Mets need him to step up. If it were not for his ability to play first, I would believe that the Mets could definitely serve themselves better with someone else on the bench.
33 and only 11 strikeouts ., that makes him a god Delgado.
Explain something to me. marlon produces but oh he’s had 11 strikeouts he needs to step up because delgado is “struggling” the word is SUCKING!
Look at delgado’s at bats and strikeouts/outs..
This Delgado discussion is akin to slamming your head against a brick wall. Delgado is making 16M… he isn’t going anywhere. Plus, by seasons end he will have given you way more production than Marlon Anderson ever could.
And while I have been very supportive of Omar, this Smith move is idiotic. Your manager can’t manage the pen, so you send off his 2nd most effective reliever. Why keep Sosa around so Willie can continue to run him out there to get lit up? If everyone was pitching well, I could understand sending Smith down, but Sosa is pitching like garbage and so is Heilman. This move does not give the team the best chance to win.
Steve C. – The point I am making is that Marlon is not producing leaving the void in offense at first complete for the Mets no matter who plays.
I dont know why we lose Smith over Sosa. Only willie and Omar understand that.. i guess its the options ..
As far as delgado, everyone told me that last year too .. and they were wrong. He will not produce plus He is not defensive.
But hey what do i know.. Delgado has everyone but me under his spell..
Keith – I agree on all counts.
Why does Willie get panned over a roster decision? He is not the GM. He has shown he likes Smith for two years now. Teams all over baseball are eating contracts because the want to win. Toronto ate 8 million with Thomas, even the lowly Pirates ate 9 million with Matt Morris. And SD just DFAd Edmonds and are going to eat whatever they signed him for. And we won’t eat 2 million??????? This is a decision coming from ownership….I won’t even blame Omar for this decision. Our bench was locked with Franco for over half of last yeart and now Sosa this year. Our bullpen has one righty who has been reliable and who has been coming on strong and we’re gonna send him down? Don’t tell me winning is # 1 priority Wilpons…...
Steve C., Delgado doesn’t have everyone under a spell. The thing is, everyone but you seem to understand what is going on here. Delgado is no longer “Delgado.” His skill are certainly in decline and his defense is all but nonexistent. However, if he can belt out 25 homers and drive in 85, like he did last season, that is about league average 1B production. So no, he is not living up to his $16 M contract, but that is still better production over the course of a season than Marlon Anderson, Damion Easley, or Fernando Tatis.
If we had a hot 1B prospect like when the Phils had Howard to take over for Thome than I could understand the beef. But we don’t. We do not have any strong options, as of this moment, to take over for Delgado. Marlon Anderson is not the answer.
Sloppy, correct. Anybody who suggests the mets eat a contract just doesn’t pay attention to the wilpon’s. If they won’t eat Sosa’s 1.7 or so that is left, they are not gonna eat Delgado’s or any other bigger $$.
Let Sosa go. Besides, even if they send down Smith, somebody else will have to go b/c Wise has to be back by Sunday (as I understand it b/c his 30 days of rehab is over).
See, I don’t think they should eat Delgado’s contract and I don’t think it has to do with $$. The Jays ate Thomas’ contract because they didn’t want his option to vest and have to pay him AGAIN next season. So they are actually saving themselves money next year by eating his salary this season. The Pirates eating Morris’ contract also makes sense because they stink and would be better off letting some young kids develop than paying Morris $$ to stink. So neither move was made with an eye to compete, and the Thomas move WAS a $$ move, because it saves them $$ next season. SD eating Edmonds… you have an argument there.
As for Delgado, he is gone after this season and for reasons I mentioned above, I honestly think he is our best option at 1B, as of right now. We just have to hope he heats up with the weather.
But I will agree on Sosa. He is a sunk cost, and they need to view this as paying Smith 2.3 M (Sosa’s + Smith’s contract). It’s not like they’re paying Sosa’s replacement millions. The guy who would be stepping in would be adding a negligible (for them at least) amount of salary.
To all – Sorry about the negative comments last night as it seems they were well deserved. Let ‘em have it!!!
As far as Sosa is concerned why don’t they ask him if he’ll go down to get straightened out a la Trachsel? It doesn’t hurt to ask and it did a world of good for the human rain delay.
Smith needs to stay for one reason – HE’S EARNED IT!!!
Delgado is never going to be the player he was. That being said I agree that substituting role players is not the way to go either. Just keep him dropped in the order.
As for 1st. you have Marlon and Damion. They got rid of Gotay and Greene both of whom played a better 1st.
I understand the money thing sorta.. But to say we Don’t have a single player that can do a better first bast. thats a crock.
Tell me honestly in the last 3 games. how many times did a ball roll/bounce past 1st base? how many bad throws from the 1st baseman?
Then when said 1st baseman wasn’t playing and another played the base. Unbelievable plays and catches were made, and the very next game they were on the bench again. why? some people say not to expose the fact that the bench player wont last. if you ask me, its because they don’t want to expose that the everyday player is replaceable.
The pitching is the prime example. no one can believe we will lose Joe Smith. B ut no one wants to believe we need to lose delgado. I dont get this mindset I really really dont..
Need to say this though. No one in the east is proving they are better than the Mets SHOULD be. If the bats continue to heat up and Pedro comes back you will see things improve.
And what about Vargas? Why is Bostick coming up instead of him? He was supposed to be there to take over for Figgy and/or Pelfrey if they struggled.
Has anyone heard about his track so far? I heard from pvhornet the other day he had a good start his last time out. What’s the deal there?
Steve, this really isn’t difficult to understand and it isn’t a crock.
Delgado is not here for his defense. So you constantly harping on his poor defense is a waste of time. The Mets knew going in he wasn’t a defensive maestro, so this isn’t even worth discussing.
Delgado hit 24 HR and had 87 RBIs last season. Obviously this is not worthy of a $16M contract, however there is no way, no how, no chance that Marlon Anderson or Damion Easley put up this kind of production. Maybe… MAYBE they could do it combined, but at this stage in their careers it would be a risk.
The fact is, right now… right this very second, there is not a strong candidate to replace Delgado. Sorry, Marlon Anderson is not going to cut it as a starting 1B in the big leagues.
I also think it’s too early to say Carp and/or Nick Evans are ready to displace Delgado. Maybe if they keep up this pace we can revisit the discussion at the All Star Break, not right now.
I’ll say it again, we need offense, specifically power from 1B… not defense. Carlos Delgado, even in this state of decline, is still our best option to fill that need. I would even argue that he is the only viable option we have to fill that need.
If you honestly think Marlon Anderson is going to hit 24 HR and drive in 87 RBIs then this discussion has reached absurd heights and I will no longer take part as it will be obvious you have some kind of agenda against Delgado.
Delgado is the least of the met problems. The problem with the mets is getting consistent starting pitching that can give at least 6 to 7 innings and the bull pen. That was the problem last year and so far it’s the problem this year.
What I don’t understand is Omar was quick to fire Rick Downs the hitting coach but yet nothing has changed with the pitching staff as a whole. Why isn’t Peterson taking a hit here, that’s my question.
tomg, I wouldn’t say Omar was “quick” to fire Downs. He didn’t get fired until the break.
But I agree, if the pitching continues to stink, a move should be made.
clm: Sosa is out of options. You can’t ask him to go down. You have to DFA him by rule. If you can’t make a deal for him in 10 days and if he clears waivers, he has the choice of going down or becoming a free agent. When the Mets sent Trachsel down, he obviously had an option left.
scoopcoop: I knew the sun would rise at least one more day when you agreed woith something I wrote!
Keith: I don’t follow your reasoning on the releases. The Pirates ownership could have easily said keep Morris, maybe he’ll get hot and we can dump part of his salary when a contender gets desperate. But they said hey we screwed up and ate it. The Mets can’t say the same about Sosa? I defended his signing but he has shown less than nothing and by not DFAing they say they don’t care about winning. There is no additional cost in dumping him. He’s paid either way and so is Smith either way.
I do agree with you about Delgado 100%. It doesn’t matter how bad he plays. Anderson/Easley/minor leagues are not a better option.
Sloppy, I didn’t defend not keeping Sosa at all.
My only point on the Pirates dumping Morris was that it had nothing to do with dumping a player with contention in mind. The fact that they dumped him shows how he had no value whatsoever.
Sloppy – Trachsel was out of options. He was designated for assignment, cleared waivers, and went to Norfolk. He was asked first if he would do it and he did.
What’s the worst that could happen here? That he is claimed by another team? Who’s that stupid?
The Wilpons=penny wise, dollar foolish.
Smith should not be sent down, but wilpons hate to pay someone if they are not playing for them so Sosa stays.
maybe spoke to soon…...from DN
Major news out of New Orleans today: Surfing the Mets has learned that the Zephyrs scratched Claudio Vargas from his start today, signaling they’ve reversed course and will promote him to take the start tomorrow against the Nationals.
Vargas wasn’t under consideration even yesterday afternoon because the spot starter was supposed to be returned to New Orleans right after the game to make room for Matt Wise.
Why did the plan change? It would look like Nelson Figueroa’s poor performance Monday night is the major factor. I’d be seriously worried arriving at the ballpark today if I were Figueroa, since a Vargas call-up would mean he’s in the rotation for more than one turn.
***
Additional major news: Fernando Tatis looks like he’s coming up, too. Perhaps Luis Castillo’s injury requires the DL.
UPDATE: Sounds like the Mets may have come to their senses and will spare Joe Smith, too. That could mean Jorge Sosa is in trouble.
It might not be Castillo going on the DL. Sounds like Angel Pagan was in discomfort with his shoulder last night.
OK clm, but you still can’t ask until he clears. I didn’t remember Trachsel having to clear waivers. I thought he was bombed one night, set the record by a Met for allowing HRs and then was in Viriginia. Maybe it was Bobby Jonmes I as thinking of. He did a stintin the minors one year as well I think.
scoop, to call the Wilpons “dollar foolish” is unfair. If anyone is “dollar foolish” it’s the GMs they hire—Steve Phillips and Omar Minaya.
The give their GMs a budget every year. And almost every year it’s a very generous budget. And almost every year, especially in the case of Omar, they give the GM full autonomy to construct the roster. It’s not the Wilpons’ fault that Omar used a lot of their dollars to sign Schoneweis, Mota, and a group of aging and often hurt veterans who have spent an awful lot of time on the DL the last two years.
I’m sure the Wilpons wouldn’t stand in the way if Omar wanted to release Delgado tomorrow. It’s a sunk cost. It won’t cost them anymore. But Omar won’t do it because it’ll be admitting a mistake and it will reflect poorly on him. He may also feel he doesn’t have any better alternatives at this point in time. And he may believe that Delgado will come around.