Mets Chat Room: Off-day edition.
-
- May
- 8
I used to be able to fly on the red-eye, but I found I was so tired that I slept most of the day and couldn’t sleep at night. Then I was up all night and basically killed the next couple of days. Getting ready to board for home. Will get back late, but should be functional after that.
Anyway, currently finishing up a story on Ryan Church. Easily the Mets’ MVP so far. I go back now and read some of the comments after the trade. Where are those posters now?
The boys are home tomorrow after a 3-3 trip. They should have won four and could have won five if they had any consistent hitting. Hopefully, they found their strokes on the Left Coast.
I won’t be home until late, so I won’t be able to update. The blog rests with you guys today. Talk about Church, about Oliver Perez – yeah, I know, what can you say that hasn’t already been screamed? _ or anything you’d like.
Take good care and have a good day folks.-JD
This entry was posted
on Thursday, May 8th, 2008 at 12:42 pm by John Delcos.
You can follow any responses to this entry through the RSS 2.0 feed.
Print This Post
| 
Church is better than I imagined although I expect him to drop off some w/the bat. He has too many swings and misses to be a .325 hitter and his swing is long too. But he certainly should hit .280/20/80. If there is one criticism it would be his outfield play at the walls (some skidish play there).
Given those numbers, when Beltran, Wright and Reyes start to hit, Mets ought to be able to score a few more runs than they have.
But the lack of clutch hits and the walks and 2out runs given up by the picthing is disconcerting.
Teixera a Met?
from Jon Heyman-SI
1. Yankees. No shot they bring back Giambi and his .150 batting average for $26 million next year. The $5-million buyout will be the best money they’ve ever spent. The Yankees are believed to be interested in Teixeira and also interested in keeping him away from the team that plays eight miles to the south, in Queens. Odds: 3-2.
2. Mets. Mets owner Jeff Wilpon is said to have been a Teixeira admirer for years, and Delgado’s only chance to stay with the Mets (his option is for a more reasonable $12 million and the buyout is for $4 million) would be to beat last year’s numbers, and that appears to be a long shot now. The tough fans at Shea already appear to have spoken with their boos for Delgado. Odds: 4-1.
3. Orioles. Baltimore owner Peter Angelos covets Teixeira. Angelos loves the fact that Teixeira has spoken positively about playing for his hometown team, and Teixeira seems to be a genuine Baltimore booster. However, 10 straight losing season can’t be a plus for the O’s. 8-1
Teixeira won’t name his price publicly. But someone who follows the markets and Boras predicts that the asking price could begin with “2’s’’ as in $20 million per year and $200 million total.
The main reason the Mets have to get him…poor minor leagues and nobody like this guy could be available for a long time…”Only late bloomers and Scott Boras clients ever make it to free agency anymore,’’ one GM said, only exaggerating slightly.”
I agree and disagree on Church scoop. He does have a long swing, and swings and misses too much to be a .325 hitter, but his swing is very consistent. He rarely gets tied up on pitches inside or dives off the plate for bad pitches away. He doesn’t bail out on lefties. He takes the same smooth, solid swing every time. And while it is a bit long, its also pretty quick, and he does a great job of keeping it in the hitting zone as long as possible. Its a swing thats conducive to making contact in the strike zone, but makes it tough for him to fight off borderline pitches, which is where the swings and misses seem to come from. It also seems like he has a good enough eye to lay off pitches well out of the zone consistently.
As for his defense, we need to remember this is his first real trial in RF. The angles are a little different, especially approaching the wall. I think considering that, he’s been nothing short of stellar. It doesn’t look like he has a fear of walls, just that when he gets back there he’s not exactly sure how much room he has at times.
Where are the stones, dammit?
Tiffany: Stones? Funny you should ask. Sitting on the runway listening to “Far Away Eyes.”
Oh, and Teixeira to the Mets? Can’t see it happening?-JD
Why can’t you see Tex to the Mets JD? I think you posted many times that you didn’t think they’d get Santana either. We know you hate the Mets, so I guess the idea of them getting better makes you sick or something. They have a ton of money, and will have a lot off the books. They will make a serious run
Happy 27th Birthday to John Maine today!
I’ve been in love with John Maine for quite some time now & predicted this spring that he would win 18 games and have an ERA below 3.5. What do you guys think about his chances?
Tex will never be a Met because it is foolish to tie 1st bast up for 7 to 10 years with one guy. Look how we complain about Delgado and he will be out the door at the end of this year.
My best guess is that within 5 years David Wright could be playing 1st base.
This being the case not wise to sign Tex.
On Church’s fielding not really sure how good he is.
I will say this compared to Nady, Green and Milledge he is definitely an upgrade.
We’re 30 games into the season. The Milledge for Church deal was stupid. I never said I didn’t think Ryan Church was a pretty good player (if you think he’ll sustain this level of production for an entire year I have a bridge to sell you), he is, its just that Milledge is going to be so much better.
Taylor gotta admire a guy who is willing to stick to his guns.
In 2010 you probably will be right, but not today.
Oh my God. I didn’t like the trade either. And to think if Omar listened to me, we might what be a 500 team? Thank goodness the trade made us a 500. team.
140 game stretch of mediocrity….......
And to think in the modern world trades are evaluated after 35 games.
Taylor,
I totally disagree about milledge, from what I’ve seen Milledge will never be this super star that some met fans think he will be. Milledge is a average fielder and he cannot hit soft/breaking balls, plus he is trouble waiting to happen.
John Delcos,
Do you think Teixera won’t be a Met because your favorite team is going to get him or is it because you think the Mets won’t pay out another huge contract for allot of years.
Sloppy,
I remember telling you that I thought Gomez would be a much better player than milledge and I forgot the exact words you said but it had something to do with if I thought gomez was a better hitter at both of there stages than there was no reason to talk baseball with me. I hate to break the news but stats don’t lie. Go check out Gomez’s stats compare to milledge’s and Gomez is a much better fielder, base runner than milledge will ever be.
You all know the real reason Tex will not become a Met…..
Thus far there is no way you can knock this Church/Milledge trade, but I think you need to give it till the end of the season to fully judge it. That said, Church’s defense has been more than gold-glove caliber and he’s the most consistent hitter in the lineup so far. Milledge on the other hand has continued some of his antics and so far is hitting around .250s. If the Mets didn’t have someone else in the wings then I can understand being angry about this trade, but they have Martinez and want to build from there.
As far Texeira…NO WAY do I give that guy 10 yrs to to the Mets. Scott Boras is such an ass. The thing is that some team will be dumb enough to do that. He’ll be 38 and likely on the downside of his career, and from an NL point of view, he’s likely to be a DH which is problem in the NL.
The same goes for Perez. Any team dumb enough to give him what Boras will ask for is just as dumb.
Oh and gomez is a year younger than milledge.
BTW, another point I want to make. Everyone says that the farm system is dry and that’s because of all that Omar had to give up to make that Johan trade. Look at the BoSox…after winning the WS in ‘04, they traded some major talent for Beckett and rebuilt another team to win last year. Their current 25 man roster features their top 5 picks from the ‘05 draft (Pedroia, Elsbury, Bucholz, Hansen, Lowrie).
Maybe if Omar wasn’t so busy with his head in the ground looking for diamonds in the rough down in Latin America, he’d actually be able to build some real talent thru the draft. Everyone wants to laud him for building this supposed presence in Latin America to attract talent…other than Martinez, tell me another guy the Mets have gotten out of that? His drafts have yet to produce anything of value and I think he doesn’t get enough criticism for that. The system is not dry because of his trade, it’s dry b/c his regime has done a bad job of stocking it
RMKMets,
There’s no doubt Omar is clueless when it come to the draft. I’ve mentioned that on this blog before. Omar has not done a good job of drafting at all. I remember when he got the mets gm job he said he was going to bring in his people and build a strong farm system. Ny question to you Omar, WHEN ?????, WHAT CENTURY????
I never knocked the Milledge trade. I was confused about it for about a day, but the more I thought about it, the more I thought it was at worst a lateral move. Its not often you can get two proven commodities for one unproven one. Granted Church and Schneider aren’t stars, they’re solid big league players who fill roles, and fill roles that this team did need to fill. Milledge could be a star one day, but his improvement rate just hasn’t been that eye popping. He has lots of trouble hitting right handers, espeically ones with good breaking stuff. He has a CFs body and a corner guy’s footwork and hands. Yeah he has quick hands at the plate, but he’s not particularly big or strong. I once read a scout comment that he’s one of these guys that is talented enough to hit for either average OR power, but probably just doesn’t have the build or mentality to do both. To me, that sounds like a poor man’s Carlos Beltran. By the time his career is over, I would not all be surprised to see him stack up pretty evenly overall with Church, just with a much earlier start.
If Church can indeed go at least .280 / .350 / .470 with 20 HR and 80 RBI (he’s well past all of those paces), and Schneider can continue to work with Pelfrey the way he did the first couple times out, then this deal might be the fleece of the offseason. Not to mention Schneider has looked at least as good at the plate as LoDuca ever did with all his singles, plus he suits the bottom of the lineup much better because unlike LoDuca he actually knows how to draw a walk.
Speaking about Lo’duca. I saw on ESPN either yesterday or the day before Lo’duca swung at a pitch and let go of his bat like he was in pain and as he went back to the dugout a fan said something to Lo’duca and of course Lo9’duca tried to become combative with the fan but either a player or a coach had to force him into the dugout. That’s the main reason why the Mets wanted nothing to do with him because of his combative temper.
do you know who the Mets first round and second round picks were in 2006
answer nobody ( given up to sign Pedro & Carlos )
Kevin Mulvey was the Mets first pick that year.
2007 first round pick
answer nobody ( given up for Alou )
2005 1st pick was Pelfrey
That draft was so bad they fired the entire scouting department.
This year is going to make or break Omar’s career.
two 1st round picks and a sandwich pick.
When you sign FA’s you hurt the farm system big time.
Also even the Red Sox make mistakes
remember Craig Hansen from St Johns
the Sox 1st round pick in 2005.
They thought he was the closer of the future.
Looks more like a bust everyday.
I think to dismiss Texiera being a Met at this point is like dismissing that Santana would be a Met last fall. It is possible. It is not a given. Lots of teams will be in the hunt. But it is possible.
And if the Mets philosphy is to be a playoff team everyyear they are going to have to buy there way into it b/c they don’t have the players in the minors to fill a middle of the order spot(except possibly FMart), along w/alot of other holes.
47MM come off the books. Wilpons have stated that they will be neasr lux tax levels. That means a payroll of 150MM or so. They can do pay him if they want too.
Sox, Yanks, Dodgers (for examples) have all signed FAs and have still managed to draft and develop players like Papelbon, Yukikolis, Cano, Martin, Loney, Kemp, melky, chanmberlin, etc…
Mets have not done the same lately or over their history of 45 yrs. It has only a little to do w/signing FAs. it has more to do w/not knowing how to draft and develop. Omar has done a poor job.
Scoop:
The one decent era of Mets drafting was when Steve Phillips was running that show (and believe me, it pains me to compliment that bufoon on anything). Got D-Wright and Heilman in one sandwich round that year. Sure, Humber may have been a bust, but he was awfully tempting looking when he was drafted. He was a dominant big game pitcher in college.
Also, just an aside, one more bit of gushing about how impressed I am with Church, that guy can hit a breaking ball. It almost seems like he must be guessing sometimes, but he definitely has an idea at the plate. For exampe, his homer the other day, he came up in an 11-0 game to leadoff an inning against Scott Proctor, and somehow managed to take a first pitch, get me over curve to the deepest part of the ballpark. He msut have been sitting on it, but how do you sit on a first pitch breaking ball leading off an inning in an 11-0 game? Very impressive, even heady if you ask me.
I didn’t know This but I heard it on Mike and the mad dog. Gomez hit for the cycle last night. Mike and the mad dog had Jon Heyman-SI on the show and Mike brought it up to Jon Heyman saying he didn’t realize how good Gomez’s was a s a player.
I said that Church had a comparable stats to Paul O’Neil…so there. Nyah!
Ryan Howard (.165 average) is making Philadelphia jealous of Carlos Delgado. Jimmy Rollins (only 12 games played, a few of those as a pinch hitter) is on a missing persons list. Brett Myers (5.33 ERA) is as likely to beat his wife as he is the opposing team. Yet overall, the Phillies have been better than the Mets. Does this concern anyone? It should. I don’t care if it’s May whatever. It really should.
Brandon Webb pitched a complete game today against the Phillies. After the game reporters mobbed manager Bob Melvin demanding to know how he let this happen. “I don’t know how it happened the beleaguered manager replied. It was the fifth inning and before I knew it the game was over.” After the game Webb’s teammates hung him in effigy.
This is terrible! Now coach is going to expect us to go all the way too. Webb didn’t shower after the game and ran out the side door to escape his enraged teammates.
AP Staff Reporter
JM, Philly did the same thing last year. Howard, utley and rollins were all on the DL one time or another and yet they found ways to win. This met team has no heart, passion. By the way, Met fans should be happy that Lo’duca and Estrada aren’t on the mets this year because there both are now officially on the DL.
Here is a minor league update that may interest you.
Jesus Flores at AAA Columbus through May 8
avg .153 3 (2b) 1 ( HR) 7 RBI obp .275 slg .254
ops .530
I know it is a small sample but still.
Webb threw just 104 pitches in 9 innings. That’s why he threw a complete game. The next time a Mets pitcher can be this economical or close to it is when they will have a complete game too.
If Webb had been at 104 pitches in the 6th inning, he wouldn’t have had a complete game. It’s all about pitch counts. Not innings.
Rollins was never on the DL last year (he played in all 162), but Utley (30 games) and Howard both were. The point is that Rollins is much more likely to come back strong – and stay back – than are Moises Alou or Pedro Martinez. And we know Howard will at least start launching homeruns, if not hit for average (in that ballpark, he doesn’t have to). The Mets need a big winning streak, or a couple weeks of very strong baseball, to give themselves some breathing room – not from the Braves and Phillies, but from the expectations that have been heaped upon them. I don’t think they are capable of that sort of consistency.
Scott—Flores was doing fine at the major league level before being sent down. Sometimes when young players get a big taste of the majors and are sent back to the minors their motivation and desire suffers and it reflects in their performance. I saw it in both Heilman and Milledge. I don’t know why the Nats sent Flores down. Didn’t seem very logical to me to keep both Estrada and Lo Duca. Flores did well last year and as I said was doing well this year. Another Bowden bonehead move if you ask me.
John, you know you always have the Lord by your side…
Honestly I didn’t know what to think of the LM trade. Didn’t know the players we got back.
But as I have said b4 in this small sample I am glad we made the trade. LM is the same player he has been the past 2 years in his new digs. Church looks like a starting OF and Schneider seems to be helping our young staff.
Kudos to Omar.
As for the drafting Omar traded his picks Mulvey and Guerra as partial payment for Johan. Joe Smith is becoming an important part of the pen and last years guys are rumored to have some stuff but are raw.
I am not saying he drafts great. It is too early for that, but it seems we are adding some talent.
His trades made us a contending team. You have to acknowledge that in evaluating the GM.
Back to my favorite subject of the day.
Apparently they didnt keep pitch count way back because well, who cares.
But in Seaver’s rookie season he pitched 18 games of 8 or more innings with one 10 inning game.
Apparently teams did not care about burning their pitchers out because well they thought of them as athletes and not couch potatos
No doubt that most Omar trades have worked out well and he has been able to use minor leaguers to make those trades.
But it sure seems like other teams can make trades and still have alot of talent around to fill in when injuries occur or when they need a guy as a long term replacement for a player lost to FA or given up in trade.
There aren’t many players that the Mets now can rely on in the minors. That is why Omar has had to use Lawrence’s and Lima’s and Defelice’s of the world.
The depth in the system was poor even before the Santana trade. Which also makes it difficult to do anything to improve the team now thru a trade.
I give Omar an A- on FA, a B on trades and a C-on minor league drafting and player dev.
Of course it can be easier to do the FA part. The trades can be hit or miss but except for the Burgos/Bannister (although I see for moment Bann has fallen back to earth) and Lindstrom/Vargas ones they have been pretty good I think.
To Tomg: Enlighten me. Who is my favorite team? I have never said so on this blog.-JD
Ryan Church and Lastings Milledge are complete opposites. Church is a polished professional. He’s a good situational hitter, a good baserunner, though not too fast. He makes all the plays in the outfield and he shows up to work ontime.
This person who knocked the Church trade is wiping the egg off his face. In fairness you have to give these things time. In early 1994 the Mets were putting out a line on how smart they were getting Ryan Thompson for David Cone a year and a half earlier. Jim Fregosi hit well his first month in 1972. But reports of Milledge being late aren’t what you should be hearing about a young, talented player.
Its like Milledge. At first I didnt like him because of his “attitude” then he started straightening up. I think Julio Franco/Willie had something to do with the turnaround. I was starting to like him but not as an everyday player. Then they traded him and we see his antics havent stopped. He had the makings of a great player, too bad he couldnt shake the street marks off.
I was the same way with Gotay, he finally won me over. I cant say i am happy they traded him it seems they traded a few players that had the ability to play first when someone wasnt performing to his abilities. And now they are scrambling to find anyone on the team who can possibly play it. meanwhile they gave up 2. Gotay and Greene. We have a few others but people dont seem to be comfortable..
as for people that think Little Metsies complain about a team even when they win: Listen Many of us older fans have watched the mets since the 60’s and have stuck it out and have always been met fans. We complain because we care. the boobirds are not good fans in my eyes. I dont care what team they root for… you dont boo your own team. no matter how much you may think u want to..
JD is a red’s fan. he was forced to report on the yankees. then was given a reprieve and report on the Mets.
;-)
tomg i was here when JD first started .. i ribbed him about being a yankee fan and he earned our respect. He;s been very fair with his reporting on the mets.
John Delcos,
sorry man, nothing personal. I got the impression you were a yankee fan by some of the bloggers on this blog but that’s not my question. I am responding to your post.
“Oh, and Teixeira to the Mets? Can’t see it happening?-JD”
My question is, Why not?
JD – any word down at the stadium on when they’d make the call on a rainout? hopefully they don’t make us go out there
“Apparently they didnt keep pitch count way back because well, who cares.”
Yeah, because who cares if you burn a player out since they were essentially indentured servants. Pre-FA salaries were much lower and teams treated these guys like race horses. Mickey Mantle got a pay cut after winning the Triple Crown because his numbers were actually worse than the year before.
It’s also a lot easier to throw complete games when teams had punch & judy hitters at SS, C, 2B, and CF. These days even the 2B can take you downtown. There are no easy outs anymore. Tom Terrific could probably blow through the bottom of an order on 9 pitches or less. That stuff doesn’t happen anymore.
I disagree on the economic angle.
if you are an owner who wants to make money it doesnt matter much if they are free agents or not. yes your costs go up but a star is a star. stars bring in the fans who bring in the money.
you dont destroy your product.
its as simple as that.
I also disagree on the basic premise of the pitchers. I keep talking about how they are treated by the organization and trained. no one responds to that. just keeps the refrain about 100 pitch count and all that nonsense.
so i am done with this topic
Keith: allow me to agree and disagree with you on this point. :-)
I watched those games. and burning out a player? Thats the player’s choice. Back then a Pitcher knew if he was out of steam. These guys get paid a ton to do what they do. Its as i said earlier. There’s only one Quaterback used in anyone game unless the QB gets injured. Otherwise he is in it for the long haul. And where his “pitch” count maybe slightly lower. he’s also needs to run and not get sacked.
With that.. I think its important that a pitcher pitch as much of the game as possible until they are unable to get it over the plate. or they are taken out for a tactic. not a necessity.
But i am just a dinosaur when it comes to the game ;-)
Let’s move on to the homestand. I say 5-2 would be a solid homestand against these two clubs.
I like to go by homestands and road trips. And despite the poor play at times of the team, I had them at 19-15 at this point (2 rain outs that they would need to win to be at the record I expected).
Mets have had the better of Nats this yr and they were 5-2 against the Reds last yr. They need to keep beating up the bad teams (8-3 against Nats, Marlins, Bucs) but do just a little better against the better ones (9-12 against Cubs, Brewers, Az, LAD, Atl, and Phils; but 6-5 against Atl, Phils).
If you push Santana to go 120 pitches or more each start, then he’s more likely to come up with a career-threatening arm injury. That could destroy an owner’s product.
And it could throw the rest of his contract down the drain. Wasting tens of millions. That’s how free agency has made today’s circumstances different. So owners need to protect their investment.
Besides, today’s pitchers are likely to push back. To revolt. If you have a pitcher you value and want to keep when he’s eligible for free agency, you have to keep him happy. The players union has been pretty powerful in modern times and will also back players on many labor-management issues.
Sexson was nutty last night! The Rangers catcher wanted Gabbard to throw at Sexson, but it wasn’t even too close. Sexson just wanted to get mad at somebody and make a scene. Six game suspension?
I will defer to those who actually watched the games, however, please answer me this. Are lineups not much deeper these days? Isn’t it tougher to pitch to deeper lineups in little league stadiums?
Keith,
I’ve been following baseball since the late 60’s and I do agree with you that baseball has changed to have more offense. Whether it’s the baseball itself or how baseball has made the newer stadiums to be more hitter friendly or how they changed the mound to benefit the hitters and how all positions in the field have better hitters over all. The power back in the day was either first, third or the corner outfield. Today any position in the game can hit for power.
Good point about lineups being weaker in Seavers time, but its more than that. Seaver didnt walk a lot of people or waste a lot of pitches. He probably threw a lot of complete games without going much over 100-110 pitches. This brings up a funny story I read about Seaver, who had great disdain for Yogi Berras managing ability. Berra came out one game to replace Seaver late in a tight game. Seaver started yelling at Yogi to get back to the duguout when he was halfway there. Pitchers of that generation took great pride in finishing what they started.
The NYT has this graphic on the Mets’s first 32 games. We have won 3 less games than a year ago, more errors, less hitting, our starting pitching is worse and our relief is horrible.
Oh and by the way the innings by relief is about the same so let us have the same season as last but worst.
So what does this mean? Alou was playing so I think that has a lot to do with the hitting. Also Jose was better.
As for the pitching I guess it boils down to Johan vs Tom/El Duque.
So boys and girls the numbers so far are against us.
Seaver was a uniquely talented pitcher—more so now that Clemens’ achievements have been tainted. So how fair is it to use him as a yardstick?
I’m sure Seaver pitched many complete games without going much over the 100 pitch count. After all, Webb’s latest complete game took him only 104 pitches. But I’d bet Seaver also had a ton of outings where he threw 130-140 pitches. Maybe even more.
The walk and hit rates have remained extremely consistent in the NL from Seaver’s time up to now. So I don’t think it’s the lineups (at least not in the NL) running up the pitch counts early … nor is it that pitchers walked fewer in Seaver’s days. Today’s pitchers are striking out batters at a slightly higher rate. So this is perhaps one reason for the higher pitch counts earlier in games.
But I think the biggest reasons for the stricter pitch count limits today are the ones everyone else has already mentioned—a different mentality due to free agency and big contracts, the specialization of the bullpen, and simply a more cautious approach to pitchers’ health. Which is good. I don’t agree with the Dusty Baker scorched earth approach to pitching.
I bet Delcos holds a special place in his heart for Andre Thornton…
The pitch to Sexson was high and about 10 feet outside it seemed to me. Even Sexson feels foolish for charging. lol
JK, while I think the reasons you cite at the end of your post are definitely the stronger ones, I just wanted to clarify my point on the lineups.
This is just shooting off the cuff, but I would imagine Seaver could take things down a notch against the 7,8,9 hitters in his day and not get burned. As tomg mentioned, you lose focus for a batter and it could be trouble.
I also agree with JK that comparing pitchers to Seaver is absurd. Seaver was probably the greatest pitcher of the modern era, especially considering the taint on Clemens’ career.
Not the first time this has been written-Willie has to fire up team by end of May or else—-from star ledger…
Randolph came from the Yankees, where the championship teams of the late ‘70s and the late ‘90s were packed with hard-nosed winners. He believes he shouldn’t need to motivate or fire up big-league players, because his teams never needed that.
In principle, he’s right. He shouldn’t need to remind major-league players that it’s important to raise their games in big spots, or not to take games or at-bats off.
But unfortunately for Randolph, his players are soft. His players are the types who don’t raise their games in big spots, who do take at-bats off. His players coast through long stretches of the season, assuming their talent will carry them through without any extra effort or emotion on their part. His players are not self-motivators, and they are a group that might respond well to being scared every now and then.
By now—after the playoff flop of 2006, the historic meltdown of ‘07 and the sleepy start to ‘08—Randolph should understand this, and he should be doing something about it. He is not.
The players in the Mets’ clubhouse remain happy and comfortable. For 11 months now, they’ve been perfectly comfortable playing .500 baseball. Something needs to change that, and it’s the manager’s job to figure out what.
If he doesn’t, Willie Randolph could find himself out of a job with himself to blame.
Keith, I understand how the DH has impacted the game. But since starters in the NL can still dial it down somewhat for the 7,8,9 hitters, things haven’t changed that much there. Which is why I just stuck to the NL.
The increased power of some of today’s hitters and the smaller parks have resulted in more runs per game, but apparently not in more batters faced as walk and hit rates have remained constant. Therefore I don’t think the pitch counts have been adversely effected by this, unless the starters are throwing more pitches per batters faced as a result. But I don’t know what that number is.
I heard today, at least Sexson apologized after the game, saying he had other things on his mind.
6 game suspension for Richie
“Throwing the helmet was not good. I know that’s not the right way to do it, but at that time I lost it.”
Heat of the moment decisions stink sometimes…
JK, I think the Mets aren’t really representative of the rest of the NL. You throw a fastball to a 7,8 hitter in the NL and they’ll pop one out on you. Think about our lineup in ‘06. We had Nady 7th and Valentin 8th. Those guys were quintessential mistake hitters.
Also, I happened to download and listen to Bill Simmons’ BS Report and he interviewed Joe Sheehan from BP. They actually sort of discussed this topic and Sheehan brought up another great point. The mounds were higher and the strike zones were bigger.
Keith—I tend to think it varies today just as it did in Seaver’s day. That some NL teams have strong 7 and 8 hitters, and others have weak ones. Regardless, the hits/game and walks/game in the NL haven’t changed since Seaver’s time. You can look it up if you don’t believe me. So today’s lineups don’t appear to be causing accelerated pitch counts as the number of batters faced per game has remained constant. As I said, the only possibility I can see here is if today’s lineups are causing a higher rate of pitches per batter faced.
Today’s lowered mound and smaller strike zone have certainly made it more difficult for starters today. But this has not resulted in more walks or hits per game in the NL. What I think the lowered mound has done is put more stress on pitchers’ arms. Tim McCarver believes that if they raised it back up, arm injuries and TJ surgeries would go down. I think he’s right. At any rate, perhaps the added stress tires out pitchers earlier in games today and this is one reason why they don’t pitch more innings.