Mets Chat Room: Just two in Chicago
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- April
- 22
The Mets were lucky they only played two games at Wrigley. As I type this they are getting on the bus to head to the airport for another two-gamer at DC.
Just a horrible showing today. Simply awful. Nelson Figueroa didn’t stink, but he got no help from his offense. Both he and Carlos Delgado combined for a defensive malfunction that kept the fourth inning alive and enabled the Cubs to score three times.
Both admitted they blew the play.
IN A NUTSHELL, Chicago 8, Mets 1
The offense was 1-for-9 with RISP and left nine runners.
FROM THE CLUBHOUSE
David Wright on the offense: “It seems like we get only one chance a game to have a big inning and if we don’t we don’t score any runs.”
Carlos Delgado on not covering first in the fourth: “I went too far off the bag, then I realized Damion (Easley) had a better angle.”
Nelson Figueroa on getting to the bag late: “I should have gone over and covered the bag. It was my fault.”
IN-GAME ANALYSIS
4th INNING: Figueroa keeps on rolling. A wasted opportunity that inning. Carlos Delgado comes up small with the bases loaded. Mets 0, Chicago 0.
5th INNING: Just weak. You’d think they’d get a hit with RISP by accident. Chicago 3, Mets 0.
6th INNING: They are only down by two runs, but why does it seem so much more than that? Chicago 3, Mets 1.
8th INNING: Ronny Cedeno slam Jorge Sosa. Chicago 8, Mets 1.
POSTGAME NOTEBOOK
-Pedro Martinez was examined by Mets’ doctors in NY and is ten days to two weeks from throwing off the mound. And, that’s throwing a bullpen. That takes him into May. A week or so of bullpens and then two or three rehab starts (five days apart), and I do believe that will put him into June.
-Two more weeks for Orlando Hernandez in the boot.
-Ramon Castro and Moises Alou played in extended spring training games.
-The offense: Five hits and only three runners reached third.
Time for me to write my story and grab something to eat. I have no intention of watching Yankees and White Sox tonight.
I turn the blog over to you guys. Let it rip.
This entry was posted
on Tuesday, April 22nd, 2008 at 2:24 pm by John Delcos.
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I agree about day baseball – I am also glad to see Wrigley Field looking so well. In fact I like Fenway for the same reason – there's some history in those places
perfect time for us europeans, 8:20 PM prime time baseball. good first inning by lilly, reyes looked lost against him.
the whole day game thing went to court..I think owner wrigley did not want night games, bad neighborhood and such, shareholders wanted night games, and sued because they were not making as much money..Wrigley lost.
Business Organizations story
what an ugly first at-Bat by Delgado, i'm getting tired of watching him
You got it backwards. The neighborhood didn't want nite games. Deal made for limit of 18. Gradually that went by the wayside.
well I will give you the benefit of the doubt. Fiancee read me baseball cases out of casebooks so I was not in full tune.
Delgado is depressing to hear on the radio.. His head is not in the game…at all.
thats how Fig 1. handles business! nice DP
Nelson Figueroa is a true pitcher. He showed the way how to pitch out of a bases loaded situation with no outs without giving up a run, good job Nelson Figueroa.
Nelson is WONDERFUL…... Who needs those rich guys when you have Nelson to do the job.
i swear to god this is last year all over again. if reyes can't put the bat on the ball next inning, i'm done following this team. they tormented us beyond belief last season, and i'm pulling the plug before they can do it again.
deju vu delgado
" if reyes can't put the bat on the ball next inning, i'm done following this team."
I hope you keep your word.
Two pass balls on DV Delgado, "Dorn" Style
me too.. i forgot how nutsy little metsies can be….. I will be nicer when i go back to DC…...
Mets need this game. Get it going, fellas.
Hi Pat from Germany: Here's your guy up again. You brimming with confidence?-JD
I didn't think so.-JD
Too bad the team isn't giving Figueroa the support he needs – where are the bats??
Delgado failing again…, Willie should bench him and get Marlon Anderson some at-Bats.
I think the goal for DV Delgado should be: To not take the first pitch for the rest of the day. Would it kill him to let the ball go by on the first pitch?
Annie: Some teams send the next game's starter ahead a day early to the next city. Looks like the Mets sent their offense.-JD
It's bad enough I had to watch Delgado kill rallies last year but do we need to see this again this year. Omar needs to wake up, this guy is so done. It's bad enough I had to deal with his poor defense but now he can't hit either so Omar needs to fix this problem. The Mets cannot go through a whole year with this guy playing every day. If they do than the Mets better have the best pitching in baseball.
you're right tomg. Get Marlon Anderson some at-Bats, throw the young but talented Mike Carp in there for a few games (this guys is tearing up AA-Ball) or get someone like Scott Hatteberg.
While I can certainly accept the argument that it is still April, and we aren't at the "bench Delgado stage," I do think he needs to drop to 6 or even 7 in the lineup. Put Church behind Beltran, because quite frankly I think this is starting to hurt one Carlos as much as the other.
There's a reason Pagan isn't a starting OF, and he showed why…
My god this team is embarrasing right now…
Wow…. can we please release Delgado, please? The dude can't hit anything, he's not athletic at all, and he can't even remember to cover 1st. What a loser…
his performance today is truly pathetic… i can't believe he will earn 16 mil this year…
DV Delgado WTF?!! I do not believe what I am hearing..
This is just sorry. Fig 1. Does not deserve this
I could not imagine seeing this..!!
John – You're right as usual. These guys don't seem very familiar with the field, either. Does Santana pitch tomorrow?
The official scorer in wrigley must have had one beer to many if he thinks there was no error by Pagan. There is no way the runner scores there without pagan playing hot Potato. Do I need to say more on Delgado. What a way to give the cubs three runs. My only hope is that the Mets are getting there crappy baseball out of the way early, if not, this will be a long season and will get very ugly at Shea this year. I'm so glad my Rangers are still in the playoffs so i don't have to watch this crap.
If DV Delgado does not make a hit or a descent play in his next go around. I am going to take a nap.
I will keep my word.
Looks like I am staying awake a little longer.
Delgado is prime example of why Omaris bad GM. Good GM gets rid of a guy when he has something left but still has value. A bad GM gets that guy.
tomg,
I have as little faith in Delgado as you do. But with whom do you suggest Omar replaces him, and which players do you want to give up to make that happen? There are no difference-makers available, and even if there were, the Mets are not likely to trade the few chips they have left in a barren farm system. Get used to Delgado, he will be killing rallies for at least another couple months before the Mets even consider releasing him.
Annie: Yes … Santana tomorrow against Tim Redding.-JD
you metsies hate the metsies more than I hate the metsies except for today.
JM, I agree, your right, just releasing some frustration. This might sound crazy but I hope the Phillies and braves are in first and second the whole year until mid August and than the Mets get red hot and pass them in September and win the division. That's how I hope this season goes.
The Mets don't have somebody in their farm system to replace Delgado. Fact is, if Delgado shows any sign of life this year they might be forced to pick up his option. ... More wasted opportunities. I've seen this before.-JD
Right now and probably in the future I will begin to agree with Pelham…however I more likely will not agree until this happens with a longer contract such as Castillo.
How would they be forced to pick up the option?
JD, no way, there not picking up Delgado's option. I don't understand why the Mets can't go after Mark Texeira next year, he will be a free agent. Delgado's buy out is 4 million next year.
Running Reb: Forced is a poor choice of words. They don't have to. My thinking is if they spend in the FA and trade markets to replace pitching (Martinez, Hernandez and maybe Perez) they might not have what it takes to make a deal for a first baseman and would be backed into a corner (hence, forced, to bring back Delgado).-JD
To Tomg: Do you really think the Braves will let Teixeira get away to the Mets?-JD
Oh man.. there has to be someone better at 1stB when any next opportunity arrives…I know it is hard to judge one game but it appears his slump has really took over him mentally, in turn affects his fielding.
How can one play be such a disappointment right now and lately?
Pagan is young he is going to make mistakes but DV Delgado is a vet (regardless of the $$ he is making which is none of my business) and he seems to be making fundamental mistakes.
Just not good baseball on behalf of DV Delgado.
The Mets have 47MM (13Pedro, 20Delgado, 6Elduq, 8Alou)coming off the books. Even if they want to sign Pedro (10MM I'd guess), they still have $$ to pay Tex and OP.
The Braves don't have the $$. He is going to be a 20MM player.
JD, the braves are not a team now with new ownership to spend big dollars and the last time i read about Texeira he wanted a no trade clause and the braves policy is they don't give out no trade clauses, so my answer is yes, I do.
moment of truth here..please don't take the first pitch
I give you more proof rebel
LoDuca traded for with a multi year contract that was too long.
Giving El Duque a two year deal
Giving Franco a two year deal
Giving Pedro 4 when the Red Sox knew he wouldn't last 3.
Castillo he shouldn't have given him more than one. Should have waited for O dog to become free this winter.
Alou 2 years. I know you all love him but a key part of the lineup who plays half the year hurts more than helps.
Mota 2 years.
DV nice job.
Well Mention the Trades he has picked up.
Beltran
Maine
Perez
Santana
Wagner
JD,
I think Teixiera is more likely to be a Yankee or an Oriole than he is a Brave next season, but that said, I just don't see him as the type of guy who would be inclined to sign with the Mets, unless their offer is head and shoulders above any other.
Mets need an XB hit here so bad.
runnin rebel,
the only trades from your list were Maine and Perez, the rest were free agents.
Brady Clark, hero. Dare to dream.-JD
sorry, santana was a trade and sign.
hooray,
finally a run scored!
well sorry but not to be that technical: TRADE, Free agent, and other
Mets lead league in runs scored on FC.
This team couldn't buy a clutch hit…
Santana has to be the stopper tomorrow….
Why are those guys not aggressive on the bags? Mets should be in the game right now (I mean tied).
Nelson Figueroa is done for the day. Here comes Scott Schoeneweis.-JD
Tex and OP both have Boras as FA. If mets want to be a team that is playoff bound for yrs, they will have to pay the piper (Boras) b/c they have no alternatives.
Getting back to Delgado, the Mets and Omar next year would be out of there minds to pay Delgado 16 million dollars. The correct move is to pay the buy out of 4 million dollars and go in a different direction. Delgado is hitting exactly like he did last year which is around the Mendoza line. Without Delgado hitting and his always poor defense, anything is better at this point.
Willie's choice of trying to win yesterday after a tough Philly series and then resting guys today against a lesser pitcher makes no sense. he should have used this lineup for game 1.
Perez has a late start his value may not be there..nor his focus.
Tex so far this season has proven his point.
The good side…
He got two good young pitchers in Maine and OP. I as much as I dislike Minaya won't take that away.
Santana…. We have to wait many years to see if that contract was too long or not.
Beltran…. We'll see on that as well. As good as he is was his contract too long with those achy legs of his. Why did Yankees back off signing him when Boras was giving him to them for less $$$.
Wagner…. I'll be shocked if he is good at end of his deal…... I'll be shocked if he is good at end of this year. His new gimmick stuff will be caught up to second time around league. But if he is then its a good sign. Meanwhile he has sucked at end of 2006 and 2007 for metsies.
Hey big rally one big run… Yippeeee…. Why do you metsies think this offense is good?
I dont think the offense is that good..
Dude it's pretty hard to nail down the timing on contracts.. What GM has does this successfully on a steady pace?
For starters:
The Stanks have their problems and it is catching up with them this year.
Willie has lost my confidence as a manger. If Willie last the season I would be surprised. If not this season I think he will be gone before the next season.
Howie Rose is one of the best radio baseball announcers I've ever heard. Wayne Hagin who replaced Tom McCarthy is not. WFAN should have given Eddie Coleman and/or Kevin Burkhardt. Or, let Howie work alone….....
Oh boy, Scott Schoeneweis is in, expect more runs by the cubs.
Oops – What WFAN should have given Eddie and Kevin was a chance at the broadcasting job.
ok, Scott Schoeneweis, so much for that, I wonder what joe smith is thinking, "man this bum left me with runners in scoring position again, damn that Scott Schoeneweis".
at least beltran has brought his glove to work today
The difference between Yankees and metsies is metsies won't go over tax level making accuracy more important. The Yankees were in terrible shape last year, everybody ruled them out and they made enough moves to make the playoffs one more time.
You metsies are going to have a lot of dead arms in the bullpen by 4th of July.
It's amazing how much the Mets are counting on Moises Alou, b/c the offense needs him so dearly and he is so likely to be back on the DL in a week.
Please stop blaming Willie for everything. If you are a professional baseball player, you should be able to do your job and play. Seems like the Mets have only 2 these days—David and Jose—and they can't carry a whole team.
The Yanks are in a far worse position this year.
Willie has some decisions to be making. Especially in regards to Deja Vu Delgado. I would like to think he will get out of his slump but how long is the team willing to waiting till they work their backup plan?
It's early, no doubt but with a first basemen who is dead wood
and a center fielder who is streaky, left fielder who can't stay healthy, not much of difference at 2nd, two aging starting pitchers who can't stay healthy and a young pitcher who has his head up you know where, I can't understand how the odds makers thought this was the team to beat in the national league.
Pelham Parkway: You nailed it. It's not that the Yankees have more resources than anybody else. That's true. What separates them is that when they screw up they can afford to keep going. How many franchises would have been devastated by such busts like Carl Pavano and Jaret Wright?
I have had enough for the day on this game.
Bottomline: The Mets have something to prove this year. More so than last year and perhaps other previous years.
Not good baseball on behalf of the Mets right now.
No one thought this was the team to beat. If I recall, everyone was on the Braves bandwagon to begin the year…
Josh,
I'm talking about las Vegas, the odds makers, had the mets as the favorites to make it to the world series.
Josh,
Yes, many people, including the Vegas folks, had the Mets as the team to beat.
I will get back to you on those odds tonight when I go to work…till then..
JD, is this guy your relative, give me a break, it is about the resources, resources is also money, it's the same, so how did he nail it? It's always about the money, period.
Oh this is not good. Cubbies can put this one outta reach.
I'm not impressed or ever will be with the Yankees. They have had by far the biggest payroll in baseball since the mid nineties before they had the money (resources) they did nothing. They have over a 200 million dollar payroll and if it wasn't for the commissioner putting pressure on the yankees to
not going over board it would be more than that and with this payroll they should be in the world series every year.
Why is everyone so negative. The Cubs are A good team, that is very hot.
Yes Delgado is a problem. A very big problem, A black hole in the # 5 spot. Beltran gets no protection from him. Hopefully Alou will give them A lift.
I think the Mets may have to trade Endy to get some help.
He has some value since he is cheap and signed through next year.
Scott from Pelham,
For whom are you trading Endy Chavez, a career 4th outfielder, that can help this team? A bat boy? A bag of balls?
If Willie had one speck of Gil Hodges in him, Carlos Delgado is sitting the two-game set in Washington. This crap has to stop…people need to be held accountable for mental errors and his cost the Mets.
Not to mention that he's just hopeless at the plate and, IMO, a key part of the aura that this team is lackadaisical.
To Tomg: Not so. Lots of teams have money. But the Yankees have money to compensate when they screw up. They can throw good money after bad. The Mets, can't, or won't do that.-JD
Has anyone seen a team in recent memory that hits as poorly with RISP or guys on base, in general? I mean…what goes through these moron's skulls.
I see guys like Jayson Werth and Reed Johnson dink two-run singles…shortening the swing to make contact. There is not one Met player, ONE, that does that.
And to add to my above post, Delgado needs to be in the 6-hole or lower from here on out, unless he goes on a hot streak. Ryan Church should be in one of two places right now:
-in the 2-hole
-in the 5-hole
Can we pleeeeeeeease do better than Randolph? LEARN HOW TO USE YOUR BULLPEN!!!...also infield in???? why…just cost us four runs
In games like this I find it helpful to imagine that the Mets are all children of developmentally disabled. Then its like the Special Olympics. You don't judge as harshly. You feel proud of them for holding a major league team to just 8 runs. Try it, you'll feel better.
This is why I wasn't willing to concede anything after they won 8 of 10 and 5 in a row. Maybe things change if Pedro and/or Moises comes back strong, but right now they look an awful lot like a .500 team.
How can this entire bullpen be so frikkin awful?? A grand slam to Ronny Cedeno, are you kidding me??
Omar has to do something… and soon..
that was supposed to say 'or' not 'of'
JD- Sosa should be out of here, like yesterday. Once Vargas/Armas are ready, bring one 'em up and stick them in his role. And if Figueroa falters, then swap them.
Sosa is toast. This is friggin ridiculous. The guy has perfected the art of giving up the grand slam. In his last 18 appearances, dating to Sep. 16 of last year when he allowed Greg Dobbs PH GS that cinched the sweep at Shea, he has allowed 3 grand slams.
T-H-R-E-E grand slams in 18 games.
I'm just proud of him for being able to reach home plate.
When did Ronny Cedeno become Hank Aaron?
How many freaking big hits does this guy have in the last 2 days?
This team (the Mets) is just not fun to watch.
JM: yes he is A fourth outfielder who plays gold glove defense and would be great in A platoon. You might be able to do A trade and get A Kieth Millar, or A Brandon Inge at the trade deadline.
JD- Please ask the Mets what they have against hitting pitchers that suck or are severely struggling.
This is a joke.
Not panicking or anything…I mean, they're 10-9 and I don't expect the Marlins to remain in first. Santana goes tomorrow and this is just one of the reasons he's here, to stop these skids before they become serious trouble, a la last September.
A few observations, IMO:
1) Sosa needs to be bought out and Armas, Lugo, Stokes brought up…can't be any worse. Not that the Mets would have won this game anyway with their hitting, but he consistently comes in and puts games out of reach by pouring gas on the fire. It's also, IMO, no coincidence that he gets smacked around when used often…he's not a good reliever.
2) Whether it hurts the offense (snickers aside) in WAS, Delgado needs to be benched. If Randolph doesn't have the balls (and he doesn't) to do this, Church or Pagan should be in the 5-hole tomorrow. PERIOD. Until/unless Delgado hits the ball with some authority and comes through, he should have a 6 or 7 next to his name for the foreseeable future.
3) Randolph seems to be OVER analyzing his use of the bullpen, as opposed to last season. Some instances, it's fine, but he's constantly using 2+ relievers/inning and it's a key reason these guys have had to throw so much. Honestly, other than a start here and there, the starters have worked 6+ innings consistently…yet the bullpen is burned out??? This is the reason.
This game is in a closed book now. I'll be up late tonight due to the PA primary. Looking forward to seeing Santana tomorrow evening.
Safe trip.
Sosa is not the problem. How Willie uses him is the problem.
Sosa is the long man and should not be pitching everyday.
He did not use Oliver this way in 2006 when he was the long man. He did a good job when he replaced Pedro when he got hurt.
Also what is the deal with Feliciano if Willie will not use him for more than one batter than he is of no use to the pen.
I said this earlier the Mets can not carry two logy's the way Willie uses the pen.
Scott from Pelham,
Where are you playing Kevin Millar or Brandon Inge? I assume you want one of them at 1B, but you haven't figured out a way to move the $16M salary that now occupies that position. And what in the world makes you think that either of those players can be a difference maker on this team? Brandon Inge is a career .241 hitter, and Millar was a worse run-producer last year than Delgado. Those are you answers for the Mets? Get real, my man.
You're right…but Sosa IS the problem. I agree that he's being used incorrectly…but I still think there are better options.
He's a fastball/slider pitcher who has a propensity to give up homers…he should not be pitching in any games other than blowouts, and that, IMO, is just a waste of a roster spot.
Agree with you re: Feliciano. I don't know if Randolph doesn't like him or what, but he's turned him into a LOOGY. Now, Feliciano hasn't impressed all that much so far, but how can he when he's being used one batter per appearance??
This guy has shown he can get RH/LH out…why is he being used this way?
And ditto for Duaner. It didn't cost them on Saturday…but using him for ONE batter in the 6th inning? And then yesterday…using him in the 7th?? Heilman is the one who's getting his tits lit up daily…drop him down to the 7th inning for awhile.
The thing about Sosa is that he is the only Fastball/ Slider pitcher they have in the pen. All the other guys in the pen are Fastball / change up. Also why is Sosa giving up so many HR's because his slider is flat and why is it flat because he is overworked.
While I'm rambling, here's my biggest problem with Randolph (who I was a pretty big fan of for the most part)
His calm demeanor is good for a sport like baseball, IMO. The season is too long with too many highs and lows to go crazy like fans do after every loss. I also know that he's deficient in on-field tactics…but that can still be overcome if you're producing.
My problem with him is that he seems to think that a change in the lineup or the bullpen is a sign of panic. He says as much if you read JD's article today re: Delgado.
"It's too early for that"
Huh? Did he learn nothing from last season? Every game counts. IMO, it doesn't mean you're panicking if you move Delgado down to sixth (or seventh when Alou returns) if it improves the clubs offense. How is trying something to help a panic move?
Who cares if the press feels this way and says so? The point is to win, and if Delgado, who kills rallies left and right, just like the first 3 months of last year, continues to do so…you drop him until he proves otherwise.
Simple. Delgado isn't a rookie, and if he can't take the demotion (which I doubt would be a problem), that he doesn't belong in the majors. This isn't a 3-4 game slump for Delgado. He has two hits in his last 30+ ABs…from the 5-hole which in turn leaves Beltran, who is slumping himself, with nothing but breaking pitches to look at.
I guess it's too much to have Ryan Church put in the 5-hole…he of the .338 avg, .397 OBP and 11 RBI??
Three ugly losses sandwhiched around 5 solid wins.
Win 2 in DC and a 4-3 road trip isn't so bad.
Sosa may have solved Mets BP problem. He goes down or out w/Wise coming back.
By the way, where is Sloppy to defend his guy Sosa?
Boy you Mets just took another beating at the hands of the Cubs, Wait until your Daddy comes to town this weekend.(Chipper and the Braves)I'm sure you already knew who I was talking about !!!
scoop: even if you replace Sosa with Wise unless Feliciano or Show start pitching more innings it will not matter.
I don't even wanna know if they don't win both in DC. After starting out w/ 2 of 3 from the Phils, to come home w/ a losing record on the trip is inexcusable.
JD,
Maybe I missed something. What I was saying is that the yankees have a unlimited resource (money) which you basically said back to me. That is my point, THE YANKEES HAVE A UNLIMITED RESOURCES (MONEY). Anyway, on a more negative note. As a mets fan I am very concerned with this team. When I look at this team I realized that this is a old team. Wright and Reyes are the only starters under 30. The pitchers under 30 are Maine and Perez. I'm not counting Santana because he is turning 30 soon. The future doesn't look bright for the Mets here with aging players and a barren farm system.
I just saw something like this at Mets Fever, and the more I think about it, the more I like it. Lets face facts, Carlos Delgado is done. He's no longer the power hitting 1B that he once was, and he's no longer a productive player. And today, when he walked away from the first base bag, costing the Mets the game, was the last straw for me. I don't care how bad your doing at the plate, you never bring it out to the field.
So here's a crazy idea. There are a lot of things that can go wrong, but a ton of things that can go right by making this move. Moises Alou is currently working his way back to the majors after having Hernia surgery. We all know that even at age 41, Moises Alou is going to rake as soon as he comes back. We also know that Angel Pagan is the exact type of player that we want playing. Someone who brings energy and excitement. Obviously, you can't have both if they're both playing the outfield, but if you ask Moises Alou to play 1B, we might have something.
I know, I know.. In his 23 year career (minors and majors) Moises Alou has never played a game at 1B. But, I also know that Moises Alou isn't the outfielder he once was. The idea is to simply ASK Alou if he'd be willing to play 1B. Tell him that you want to know if he can play 1B 2-3 times a week. Make him work out with some of the minor league coaches at 1B, and play the remainder of his rehab games there. I'm sure if you told Moises Alou that it would benefit the team, at age 41 and at the end of his career, looking for a world series ring, he's not going to tell you know. Did Pete Rose want to play LF? No, but look what happened when his manager ASKED him to do it.
What would you do with Delgado? Personally I'd throw him flat on his ass, but I'm not sure any GM in baseball would do that.. I guess if your the Mets, you play him against right handers, and try to shop him around to any teams in the AL looking for a DH. Ok. I'm done. Let me have it.
In response to Millar or Inge either one right now would help at least against left handed pitching.
Also Inge could give Wright a day off at third.
As far as Delgado goes if he does not start hitting by the end of May they may just have to bite the bullet and release him.
I know many say the Mets would not do this but it could happen. What's the point of keeping him if he still continues to be useless.
The 86 Mets dumped George Foster and they were in first place.
The Jays dumped Thomas and he was their best hitter last year.
Omar knows his job is on the line anything could happen.
Roger: Alou is not likely to play first. Delgado could be gone if things don't get better see my other post.
What about trying Castro at first against left handed pitching
when he comes back.
The Mets are not gonna eat 15MM of Delgado's contract. They barely were willing to eat 4MM of Matsui's. They don't do that. The pt of keeping him is the Wilpons are paying him. They don't like to pay guys to play elsewhere.
Alou is not gonna play 1B.
Omar's job is not on the line. He kept Willie in part b/c he can blame him if things go bad. It is the oldest co. politics game around and Omar plays it well while Willie does not.
Pitching was not the biggest issue these last couple of games. You score 1 run, you lose.
Putting on my glass is half full which many on this site hate….
Let's remember that the Mets have played 13 games against some pretty decent teams and 6 against some bad ones. 10-9 is not great but they just need to wade thru the difficult teams a tad better than they have (6-7 instead of 5-8 would have been ok) and squish the bad ones(5-1).
I had them going 3-4 on this road trip. They can still do that or even go 4-3 w/2 wins against the garbage Nats.
Mets are 6-3 at home and 4-6 on the road. If they win 2 at DC they will be .500 on the road and .667 at home. I'll take that all yr.
Putting on my glass is half empty hat which some people are always at (or some for those that are at glass with a couple of drops in it all the time)....
The pitching is giving up an alarming # of HRs. They are also givin up alot of runs w/2 outs (of course they have played 13 games against teams that hit alot of HRs). Didn't look it up but I'd bet the team gave up on high # of 2 out runs last yr. So the trend seems to be continuing.
The Mets need Alou back soon b/c teams are pitching around Beltran and he is becoming frustrated. Willie will have to put Delgado at #6 and move Church back to #2 to split up the lefties (why Willie did not leave Church at #2 is beyond me-it was workin well).
Cross fingers that Alou can stay healthy for a good stretch or the team is gonna have difficulty scoring if Reyes and Wright are not hitting.
It would also help that Pedro is back sooner than June (but that does look to be the case) so that Figgy can go to the BP and Sosa can be tossed (his slider has always scared me and it is really scary right now).
Castro at first? come on.
He'll have to play at the bag to be ready for throws.
I don't think having Moises Alou learn to play first at age 41 a month into the season for the first time ever is a good idea. Remember how inept Piazza was? I don't really have a good solution..hope Delgado gets hot, maybe drop him to sixth with an occasional day off, wait to June to see if this Cap fellow has more experience. Maybe some out of it team cuts a reasonably decent first baseman.
Bill Veeck said the reason Phil Wrigley never had lights was since he wasn't the first to do it (the Reds under Larry MacPhail were), he was never going to do it.
The team will no doubt sweep the Nats and all will seem right in the Mets universe. Until the next three game losing streak.
90-72. 18 games over .500
That's 3 games over .500 per month.
Just some perspective.
Besides do you want Alou to get another hernia strecthin for those balls at 1B? ouch!!
Just b/c the Mets aren't very good doesn't mean the discussion should deteriorate into the absurd. Castro can't even run yet, and like Scoopcoop said, would have to play on the bag. Alou is a career outfielder, and at 42 is not going to learn a new position. Delgado, if he is ever released, will not be dumped until he shows for a couple months that he has nothing left. Any plausible suggestions out there? I haven't heard any as of yet.
some more pespective….
Following BB is like following the stock market.
Gettin too caught up in the day-to-day up and downs can cost you alot of upset stomachs.
Map out W and L on the schedule by plotting out homestands and road trips. If you are objective about it (not emotional) like picking stocks you will probably find that the Mets are right about where they should be (I had them at 11-9-rain out in Atl)...
First base is a problem right now, but they are handcuffed by Delgado's contract. They won't eat it and he can't be traded. His value is in the hope he'll turn things around. I don't see them fooling around with Alou at first, either.-JD
Scoopcoop,
I agree we need some perspective, but I also wouldn't count on BOTH the Phils and the Braves NOT to win 90.
I think they have to. If they want to have a chance of getting to the WS. I thought they could do it with Delgado this year. But I didn't think he would get much worse. I thought he'd produce roughly what he gave them last year or a little less. But it's much worse. And his defense has gone to the dogs. It's pitiful. It's not fair to the rest of the team to put him out there every day.
It's useless to just platoon Delgado. I don't think he'll be happy in such a situation. I think they either play him or release him. And if they play him, he'll continue to cost them games. If not with his bat then with his glove. And you can't hide his bad glove in the lineup.
They will just be delaying the inevitable by waiting until May or June to make the drastic move they need to make. How many games is that going to cost? Omar needs to act. Sooner rather than later.
I don't see Alou as a solution for first either. He's too old to make the adjustments. Perhaps an acceleration of the development of Carp and/or Marlon and Easley sharing time at first is the solution.
Any truth to the rumors about Omar trying to bring in Orlando Merced to play first base?
I'm right here scoop coop. Nothing for me to say. I was belittled by people like you for being so damn negative in spring training when you all thought we had the greatest offense since the 27 Yankees and the greatest pitching staff in history. So I'm just sitting back not depressed, not angry, just realizing I unfortunately had a better analysis of this old decrepit team, a team that has seemingly forgotten or never practiced fundamentals,a team with little hweart little fire, little spark. Do you want me to be a baby like you and say told you so. Nah, Just sorry I was right.
You want my analysis.
Offense: You set yourself up for disaster by making your main protection for your 3/4 guys a guy who spends half the year on Defense. You stuck now because you got a # 2 guy who has deteriorated so quickly he can't do anything. And if you move him to # 8 spot the bottom half of your lineup is so weak you can't have much offense.
Starters: I expect them to implode if the offense doesn't get going. They are throwing too many pitches because they are afraid they can't give up a run. A la the 1970 team.
Relievers: They are being overused to extreme because the coaching staff is afraid of giving up a run and they willburn out, well they may never get going long enough to burn out. Your question about Sosa: What is he Everyday a new job, he probably doesn't have a clue what he's doing on the mound.
We've now been a .500 team for 130 games or so…. What I don't understand is why does anybody expect a 90 plus team to suddenly show up.
I'm happy they are 10-9, and that I didn't make plans to go on any roadtrips this year. They just aren't a fun team to watch after Jose and David…..
Sloppy, I think it's a bit early for the "I told you so's."
We're not even out of April yet and everyone is panicking. Calm down.
Baseball should be enjoyable. Once it becomes agonizing maybe its time to find something else to devote your time to.
Plus, I think we're getting too worked up over the last 3 losses. Look at the context. The first loss came after we took the first 2 in Philly. Sweeps are tough to come by, especially against a team as good in Philly in that park. We lost to Zambrano in Chicago. No shame in that. As for the loss today, yeah it stunk, but Figgy was bound to put up a stinker, Lily is much better than his ERA indicates, and we didn't exactly have the "A" team out there today.
I think Carp should be brought up ASAP. Flores was supposed to be not even close to ready for the bigs, which is why Omar left him unprotected and the kid has done pretty well. Are you telling me that Carp couldn't give us Delgado's production? The Wilpons can do what they please, but Delgado will be run out of town next season if he continues to play this way. I don't think the fans will stand for it.
Sloppy, why is it that when anyone points out that your analysis is wrong (like Sosa), you change the subject (to the team in this case) and start name calling?
I was talking about your love for Sosa. The guy has stunk it up.
Besides Sloppy, how do you know you are right about the team?
It is 19 games.
And since you have not been right about Church or Scheinder or a some other items, I wouldn't be tooting my horn about how you are right about the team.
Chris, that is an excellent point. Jacobs also came up straight from AA when he made his debut as well.
Look, there was nothing Minaya could have done about Alou and Delgado. He was wed to Delgado's contract and I will not criticize what I, and most Met fans, felt was a solid acquisition in '06. As for Alou, imo, he represented a significant upgrade over anyone the Mets could have had in free agency over the past two years. Yes, he was a gamble, but if they could have somehow gotten 110-120 games out of him, you know he would have hit.
Here's the problem with the Mets: Endy Chavez, Marlon Anderson, Damion Easley, and Raul Cassanova.
Our bench stinks.
When you have position players who need/should be/would be more effective if they sat down once or twice a week (and injury prone to boot) you need to assemble a better bench.
Now I'm not saying it is easy or that I even had anyone in mind, but players like Jorge Cantu or Justin Huber, guys who anyone could have had for a song, would have at least given this team some players with upside who aren't just slap hitters.
Delgado needs to hit sixth or lower after him having a few badly needed (not by him, but by the team)days off. Sosa should be the one to go down when Wise is ready to return since he seems to believe that he can beat batters with pitches that get way too much of the plate and become moon shots! Willie still seems like he keeps himself too detached from the game. And Peterson's miracle methods with the relief staff so far this year earn him a failing grade. The Mets do not look like a team this year which has carried over from last year. They look like they are in a pick up game somewhere. Willie has to find a way to rally the troups before things start to turn even uglier than the blow outs and anemic hitting of the last two days.
I love it how people are calm, especially after two things:
1. How quickly things fell apart for the Mets last year.
2. How quickly things fell apart for the Mets last year.
I am not saying that people should panic but I understand how frustrated the rest of the fans are.
Last I checked it was 2008 and we:
A) Added the best pitcher in the universe to our rotation.
B) Significantly upgraded RF and C.
This is a new year and a new team. I understand how people are frustrated, but I just don't agree with it.
Don't agree with why people are frustrated. Whatever, that's is your deal. I think many are. I agree with why.
By adding an ace, replacing a catcher and right fielder does not simply make the Mets a new team. It makes them a different team. Whether they are a better team this year, is debatable until later on the season. A new team would involve more replacements.
I would like to think Johan is the best pitcher in the universe but I feel that it is "too early" to tell what he has done for the Mets. So far-so good with him. Lets just hope he keeps "it" up (not the balls in the strike zone though).
As for the other two guys, I do not know if they would be a significant upgrade from what the Mets had before. However, they clearly exceeded the expectations of many so far.
The game in Chicago the other night exposed some clear concerns that can get worse later on if laid-back Willie does not make the adjustments. I thought he knew his players more than anyone else?
Well if that it true, why still tinker with the lineup? Because it is early in the season?
Fine, I hope he comes to a conclusion soon, before it becomes "too late".
If a line-up works, why not run with it? (IE the first few games in Philly).
scoopcoop, I think scoop coop that in dealing with people like you with very little grey matter, it doesn't matter what i said because people like you have no comnprehension iof anythigb. If you would havwe had the mental stamina to read the entire post you would have found, if you could have comprehended, that I indeed answer your infantile question. Now I guess you really want to be the whipping boy. Bring it on coop.
Not right about Church?.... The guy got a few hits, plays lazy baseball. Goes thru the motions, refuses to dive for a ball. Stops dead in his tracks on the bases to avoid anything that would look like he cares abolut the game, kevin McReynolds without the ability to steal or hit in the clutch… and a fatal flaw flaw to chase breaking ball way out of the zone wigth runners in scoring position I got him right…Maybe you should open your eyes vice watching with your preconceived notions of prefection… Schneider, a singles hitter who forgot how to even catch the ball from the pitcher. That impresses you. My little league catcehrs catch more balls than he does.
Anyway scoopcoop, your opinions of the best bullpen, the best offense blah blah blah have totally shown you for the Omar lackey you are….. Will you be fired with him…..?
Sloppy, Church is playing well. Not sure how you can criticize him, you're grasping at straws. And Schneider has been solid too. They're both doing exactly what I hoped they would do. As for him not catching the ball, I buy the glove excuse. That model glove he was using takes forever to break in… and even when it's broken in it isn't the greatest. He seems to have straightened that out since he switched gloves.
Rebel, don't be obtuse. Johan is the best pitcher in baseball. How can you seriously say, this isn't a new team simply because we added an ace…, effectively minimizing us adding Johan as if we added Kyle Lohse when all I heard all last year and all offseason was how this team was an "Ace" away from being the odds on favorite to win the NL. And on top of that we added a catcher who actually brings something to the table. Last year you might as well have had a net behind the plate as a catcher and then send up a traffic cone to hit. Because that was the kind of production we got from LoDuca last year. He was awful on defense and had an OBP below .300. He was terrible. Green was serviceable in RF, but Church is far superior defensively and provides more power offensively.
I'm sorry if I'm not going to join the rest of the chicken littles in screaming "the sky is falling" when we're still in April. We took 4 of 6 from our nemesis, so excuse me for not getting bent out of shape for losing two straight to a good Cubs team that threw Carlos Zambrano in the first game and Ted Lily (who is a much better pitcher than his statline suggested) against our "C" team in the second game. One more point about this last game in Chicago… it's only one game. Don't make the mistake of judging how this season will turn out off of one game where Brady Clark, Damion Easley, Raul Cassanova, and Endy Chavez were in the starting lineup.
We've only played 20 games, are 2 above .500, in second place, and took 4 of 6 from the team that killed us in the second half last year. We've done all of this despite not having our everyday LF and 5 hitter in the lineup, with our #2 starter on the shelf, and our #5 starter on the shelf. Further, our current 5 hitter and 1B has been playing like garbage and our 2B and 2 hitter hasn't been much better. I'll also note that Beltran hasn't been playing so great to start the season either.
Our pitching is strong and the bullpen will settle down. I also expect the bats to heat up once May rolls around and the weather turns. Delgado and Castillo may not play like "Delgado" and "Castillo", but they don't have to. They just need to give us some solid production to go along with the outstanding Wright, Reyes, and Beltran.
I'll leave you all with a few things to consider:
After last April I remember reading some Mets fans wanting to send David Wright down to AAA.
For those who tell me that this isn't a new team, well, the 2007 team was supposed to be the same team we had in 2006. How did that turn out? So don't tell me that a new year and a new season can't bring change.
maybe they're doing all right but scoop coop delights in this kind of stuff so just want to keep his misconceptions happy.
As far as the team being the same or diffeent Keith the players don't matter as the way they play. and this team including the 2 ex-nats play the same lazy boring fundamentally not very sound brand of baseball the team played last year. Basic stupid mistakes that a team with their heads in the game all the time don't make every single day. The team has continued to play mediocre brand ball.
And while tyou brag about some wins vs the Phils with injuries, they respond that they will kick our butt when they have their MVP back. So when I see someone using injuries to defend a team';s play i see someone who is in need for excuses because the quality of play is bad. And the qulaity of play of the 20087/2008 mets is low, very low. And while you defend the loss becauase some subs were playing, the subs at least have shown some fire, Its just too bad there aren't enoug subs to have them all play wioth Wright and Reyes and at least you'd see a lot of hustle, Maybe Charlie Samuels apreciates clean uniforms, but baseball fans don't/
Sloppy, that is the flaw in all your arguments. I could give a crap about grit, fire, and all that nonsense that sells Hollywood sports movies.
Give me JD Drew over Angel Pagan every day of the week and twice on Sundays. Why is that? Because the guy is super talented. He may not run into walls and run like his feet are on fire, but he is and always will be a much better baseball player than Angel Pagan, Brady Clark, and Damion Easley. So if we had a whole roster of subs around Wright and Reyes you may see a lot of hustle, but you would also see a lot of losses. But hey, they would be gritty losses, right?
As for not being fundamentally sound, Ryan Church should not be bunting. It's not his game. While there is no excuse for Castillo or Reyes not getting bunts down, I can't see how you could put on a bunt for Church or Cassanova and expect it to turn out well. And Willie supposedly "knows his guys."
And I wasn't making excuses. Every time the Mets do something well, you guys qualify it and I am getting sick of it. If they had dropped 4 of 6 from the Phils you would have bitched and moaned until the internet exploded. So they go out and beat the Phillies, yet you say they did it with Rollins out of the lineup. Well guess what… we didn't have Alou and half our team was playing like garbage.
If I am being unreasonable, just tell me and I'll shut up. But I think it's ridiculous, after they take 4 of 6 from Philly to get all pissy because they lost two straight games in April. One to Carlos Zambrano, who is one of the best pitchers in baseball, and the other while fielding a team that is not an accurate representation of the team's actual lineup.
Keith,
you forget that the phillies were without Rollins, he is the mvp of that team, so beating the phils 2 out 3 doesn't impress me that much. I do agree that church and Schneider have been goo, not that I disagreed with that trade because I was one of those fans who felt that Milledge would never be this great player other met fans think he will be. The problem IMO with the Mets is that they are an old team. Except for wright and Reyes, Maine and Perez, the rest of the team is over 30. The farm system is barren. This doesn't look good for the future.
I forgot Santana and pelfrey but the mets still have a old team.
Let's face it – W/Delgado's age and salary even if he were playing better he would be difficult to trade. With the lack of 1st baseman in the minors we are stuck with him.
I would like to see him dropped in the order when Alou comes back and given much more time off with Easley and Anderson getting some time.
I hope that would fuel the competitive juices and get him going. He is hurting Beltran as protection. Alou should help!!
A man by the name of Green did a rather decent job last year.
I am sure one of our utility guys who are actually hitting could make the transition to 1st pretty easy.
Beltran is in a slump too. but at least he is FIELDING. Delgado was never a good fielder. and now he is totally useless as i stated last year. he's a hole in the lineup batting 5th drop him to the 7 spot. or remove him all together. He's either injured or distracted with his new kid.
Either way if it was one of us we would be benched.
"you forget that the phillies were without Rollins, he is the mvp of that team, so beating the phils 2 out 3 doesn't impress me that much."
I don't want to hear it. Taking 2 out of 3 in Philly is impressive, with or without Rollins. The Mets are playing without Alou and with the Ghost of Carlos Delgado at 1B… so I don't want to hear about the Phillies not having Rollins. With or without Rollins, they weren't beating Johan or Ollie.
"The problem IMO with the Mets is that they are an old team. Except for wright and Reyes, Maine and Perez, the rest of the team is over 30."
This is a false statement. Our entire starting rotation, except for Figueroa, is under 30. Beltran and Schneider may be over 30, but they are just over 30 and in the prime of their careers. Castillo is only 32, but looks older because of his knee surgeries. Pagan is only 26. The only guys with significant age on this team who we need to worry about are Delgado, Alou, and Wagner. Delgado is someone to worry about, but the latter two haven't given us any reason to be worried.
"The farm system is barren. This doesn't look good for the future."
Again, this is not entirely true. We all know about Fernando Martinez and Jon Niese. But they also have some good young arms down on the farm in addition to some nice looking hitters, namely, Nick Evans, Mike Carp, Danny Murphy, and Lucas Duda. They also have this kid Wilmer Flores who just came over to the States who the scouts are high on. Hector Pellot is another name to keep in mind.
I'm not saying any of these guys are going to be stars and most likely they won't be stars. But there is no reason they couldn't contribute to the club.
Keith,
I'm sorry that you don't want to hear it but the fact of the matter is one of those wins against Philly the mets would have lost because the replacement for Rollins at short gave the game away with errors.
"The only guys with significant age on this team who we need to worry about are Delgado, Alou, and Wagner. Delgado is someone to worry about, but the latter two haven't given us any reason to be worried."
I say that's a pretty big deal considering two of those guys
the mets depend on for offense and the other is the closer.
OH yes, you forgot castillo also.
Keith,
I commend you for your confidence in this team but I don't feel confident that this team is as good as people think and I still don't think they will win there division, I hope I'm wrong, time will tell.
Castillo is 32.
Wagner is pitching great. Age suddenly becomes an issue when the player starts to perform poorly. No one discusses age in regard to Smoltz. The same should go for Wagner. Wagner has been very good for us. Ditto for Alou when he is in the lineup.
tomg, my main point is that there is no point in being confident or not confident… it's just too early. I could see the season going either way. My entire goal was to bring a bit of perspective while everyone is running around like chickens without a head because we lost to Carlos Zambrano and followed that up with a loss where we fielded a crappy lineup.
"the fact of the matter is one of those wins against Philly the mets would have lost because the replacement for Rollins at short gave the game away with errors."
Ok, his replacement made two errors. But there is no way for you to definitively state the Mets WOULD HAVE LOST. There is absolutely, positively, no way of telling what would have happened.
I could play this game too. Had Moises Alou been healthy, we would have won even if Rollins was in the lineup. I could argue that if Pedro were healthy we would have swept. Also, don't forget that Bruntlett made that great play on Beltran's shot up the middle to end the final game of the series.
I just find it amusing that METS FANS are actively looking for ways to qualify the team's 5 game winning streak.
What's even more amusing is all this drum beating to have hello from DC banned.
Mets fans do a good enough job disparaging their own team!
Annie, it was so good to hear you agree that the blame is not Willie. I think these boys should be held accountable for their terrible playing, but they will be fine, not even out of the first month yet… As I sit and listen to all the things being said by “supposed” fans of the Mets, and people professing to be knowledgeable about baseball in general. I am compelled to take a moment to write a few comments myself.
The thing that drives me crazy is listening to all the people criticizing Manager Willie Randolph. Who is doing a SUPERB job of leading the Mets. There was a man on the train who commented to me (I was wearing a Mets jacket) that they had a bad weekend. I replied the season is young and they will be fine. He proceeded to say I don’t know, I do not like how they are playing, and added, and they really need to keep that Randolph on a short leash. Then on the radio this morning, there were people who were again talking about Mr. Randolph and how he has made “bonehead” moves, and they need to keep an eye on him. The proverbial “they” I am assuming is Minaya and The Wilpons.
Historically, managers are used as “scapegoats” when it comes to teams not winning or playing poorly. There have been some really bad managers who deservedly got the blame (Lee Mazilli with the Orioles, who was fired mid-season). But I digress…. To my friend on the train, I asked him how he figured Randolph was somehow to blame for the team losing; he really could not point to anything specific, but did make some comment on sending a runner home… (Yep, I can see how that is going to bring the Mets down, give me a break that is just aggressive ball, and had he been safe, it would have been the runner who was the speedy genius.) I then brought up that Mets “savior” Santana at the time was 1-2, he commented that he held the Braves to 1 hit, but that his team was not hitting the ball to back him up…. THE TEAM!!!!!! Willie is not standing behind them swinging the bat with them, as you would do with a 5 year old that one is teaching to bat, to the contrary, these are men that get paid MILLIONS of dollars to do a job. He then says he is disappointed in Reyes, he is playing like he does not even want to play anymore, like his heart is just not in it… again I say, How is Willie to blame for this??? Our pitchers are not pitching, our defense is full of errors, and our bats are not swinging, collectively. Yet everyone is so quick to blame our manager. At what point do we hold the players accountable for their salaries??? If I do not do the job that I get paid to perform, it is not my boss who gets reprimanded, or fired, it is ME !!!! So, again, I ask, when are these players that are getting paid millions of dollars to produce going to be held accountable for what they are NOT doing??? My train friend said to me well yes that is true, but he does not motivate his team, he is too instructional. ?????????????? WHAT????????
From what I have been watching apparently he is not instructional enough… I grew up playing baseball/softball year round through high school from the age of 7, I then joined the Air Force, and played softball for the air force, I have coached numerous teams, boys and girls, from 5 thru 18, and continue to play even now, So I do know a thing or two about the game, and it seems the Mets right now are making fundamental mistakes, not covering where they should be, making it seem that the player is unaware of where the play should have been, and what his role is. This is one of the things you always teach a YOUNG team, always know what to do when the ball is hit. If it is hit to you, know what you are going to do with it, or what to do when it is hit elsewhere… the kinds of mistakes professionals should not be making… and I am guessing Willie is assuming that his players already should know. (Could you imagine your surgeon making a “fundamental” mistake, OOPS, I am sorry sir/ma’am, I should have amputated your right leg, I took off the left accidentally, but hey the chief of staff should be kept on a tight leash, he could have prevented me from making that mistake) Small ball, fundamentals, it can win ballgames…. And the PLAYERS are the ones not executing. Yet Willie is being blamed. He is a winner, played as a winner, and coached as a winner. He was a great force in the Yankee clubhouse, and now the Mets and they are fortunate to have him. He knows the game and knows his players, and what is going on with them, things that John Q Public is not aware of, he makes changes, based on knowledge he has and because obviously the way things are is not working, then gets criticized for it and that becomes the reason for the Mets not winning. He does not make a change, and shows confidence in his players and their ability, and that becomes the problem, why is Willie not doing anything about it ??? Wake up people, while he may make some moves that one may say, “I did not get that one”, that is OK, but I have heard over and over again I hate Willie, fire Willie, and on and on…. I am having a hard time believing that people really believe that he is to blame for dead bats, errors, and very simple fundamental mistakes. The Mets were not even on the map, of recent, until Willie took over the helm. Those of you who have such a problem, when another manager spot opens up, on any team, go for it, you are obviously more qualified to manage a team, and I am so sure your team would make it to the World Series, your first year as a manager. Shame on all of you, including announcers and writers, who add their own commentary and personal bias’, report what happened and let people draw their own conclusions.
I hope Mr. Randolph knows that there are fans out here who know what he brings to the team, and the organization as a whole, and believe that he is doing a great job, trying to maintain discipline and harmony, and those of us who know that a whole lot more goes into managing a team than innings, outs, balls and strikes, and believe in him and know he will get us there. It is always easier for one to manage from the stands.
A final thought- Get behind your team, PERIOD!!! The season is young, and as we all know, you can have a HUGE lead and it all fall apart. (AGAIN, fundamental stupid errors are what lost the season for us, collectively) It’s a good team and Willie is a great manager, and they will get the job done!!!!!!!!!! Have some faith and show some support for the team you allege to be a fan of… win or lose… BE A TRUE BLUE FAN!!!
Sorry John, did not mean to rant… : )
Keith,
please don't compare me to that moron. If you don't think the Mets don't have issues here than you have blind faith.
Mets are 12th in the NL in slugging. They are an embarassment on offense.
btw could Marlon Anderson actually get a base hit.
I still have faith in the Mets and don't think their problems are widespread. It's basically just Delgado who is dragging this team down, as well as the bullpen other than Wagner. If they straighten/fix those areas, which is doable, this team is still the one to beat in the NL East. But the can't wait on Delgado too long. He's dragging the whole team down with him.
I don't know how anyone can be unhappy with Church and Schneider so far. Church defensively is better than Green, Milledge, Nady, and Pagan who is worse in the OF than I thought he would be. Church is just a notch below Beltran and Endy in terms of defense. He's also hitting both lefties and righties and with men in scoring position. Schneider has the 4th best OBP for a catcher in the majors so far. I wouldn't be too concerned with the passed balls earlier either. He hadn't caught these pitchers often before and was breaking in a new glove, which he ended up chucking. They've been two of the more productive players on the team, along with Wright and Pagan.
tomg: You call me a moron for blasting another team. I don't hate your metsies half as much as you do. Three little losses and all the fair weather metsies are beating each other and most of the team. What a sad sad commentary on the metsie community. I feel bad for keith having to co-exist with all these fair weather fans.
We may be last but we at least don't hate our team. And I bet most of you wish you could trade 90% of your team for one Jimmy Rollins.
Well off to the park, I was gonna be nice to the metsies, but why bother, since you all hate them so much anyway.
Keith, You may not care about fire but I am a firm believer in it. If you don't get worked up in a competitive environment you don't excel. We certainly can disagree all we want and neither can prove, but I will never be convinced that the Mets could have come back like the Phillies did last year. Why, Their manager, for all of his in game flaws (like Willie) never did or said anything to stifle their enthusiasm. Yet, from the Mets we heard about all the kids having too much fun. Now when the team is so obviously moribund from this lack of enthusiasm we have to have Carlos Beltran tell Jose to get it back. Why. Because it matters. But, Minaya gave a team of robotic players. And the results are that they don't come back, they give up when games are tough, they don't perform well in the clutch, Yes, I think it matters a lot.
I think fire won us the 73 pennant, i think fire gave those Willis Red led Knicks a championship over a far superior Lakers team, I think it gave the Giants the /super Bowl this year. I think its why the Braves failed so often in the playoffs, they had a bunch of Glavine's who died when things got tough, enough…. I don't want to go team by team.. I guess you know I didn't love Kevin McReynolds either, but give me Keith or Gary or Dykstra any day, because they'll exceed their skills. And give me Bobby Valentine with all his warts, to Willie Randolph any day, any night….. Give me Gil Hodges…. Carlos Delgado would have been taken out on the spot yesterday….. Just ask Cleon Jones…..
"Well guess what… we didn't have Alou and half our team was playing like garbage. "
I think you were very close to nailing it. Half our team is playin like garbage because half our team is garbage..
Keith, people calling for the idea of sending D-Wright down to AAA is a bit different than what the Delgado stir is all about.
D-Wright is quite younger than Delgado. Delgado is also coming off surgery. Plus no one is asking for Delgado to be sent down to the minors. I am convinced that Delgado has the mechanics to perform is job to an expected level. I also believe that Delgado has more of a mental issue about his slump more than anything else. It has affected his plate work and now his fielding (lets not forget he did throw into Utley not long ago).
As for Santana, he is in a new ballpark, a new league and in a new clubhouse. With that being said thre maybe an adjustment period for him until he really kicks it off. By the way if he was the best pitcher in baseball (if we are talking about the present) then his stats would show for it. Right now Peavy, Haren and Webb appear to have better starts. Not to take away from Santana but the proof is there. Santana was also suppose to bring a great deal of confidence for the Mets. Do the Mets have confidence right now? The make say so but their start might be showing otherwise.
As for the two Nationals, both showing great promise in their roles. I am still not too convinced on Schneider's defense but I am more optimistic about him the others in the club house. However I made my point with these two. I really do not think you gained any ground from your point of view. We will just have to agree to disagree on this.
You may not have had high expectation for the Mets this year but I like the other fans expected them to hit the ground running. Kicking ass to the lengths of Arizona. I know they have faced some hard teams aready but it is not going to get easier for the Mets.
Yes, I expected some sweeping. I think the Mets did too. Oppportunies were blown already this year. This is the bulk of the frustration lives in the Mets fans.
Adding those three guys certainly helped things out so far. However, making the Mets a new team? I just really disagree with you on that.
The problems that are currently going on with the Mets right now are the same or very similar type of problems that went on last September. (those problems no need to mention since we all know them.)
Bringing a guy with a boot on his foot will not change things and perhaps will make things worse. Fig 1. and Pelfrey are both doing better than anyone has expected and have favorably benefitted the team considering their amount of time in MLB.
Tinkering with the line up is just not a good idea on many levels. The line up should already be intact with very little flexibility. That is my opinion. Take it or leave it.
Bench is a bench …not a give them some start time on a once or twice a week basis. What gives Willie that confidence to leave out some of his starters for yesterday's game? Don't give them days off because they are tired. Injured? Sure. Tired? Get over it. You can argue this if you want but I don't care what else is to be said about it.
Fact of the matter is this is Willie's team he can do what he wants, the record heading into October will show his efforts for better or worse (hopefully for the better). If for worse I am willing to bet Wilpon will find someone else.
You Nationals don't hate your team? Why is the new stadium not selling out or even coming close to it during their home games?
"And I wasn't making excuses. Every time the Mets do something well, you guys qualify it and I am getting sick of it. If they had dropped 4 of 6 from the Phils you would have bitched and moaned until the internet exploded. So they go out and beat the Phillies, yet you say they did it with Rollins out of the lineup. Well guess what… we didn't have Alou and half our team was playing like garbage."
If your getting sick of the qualifying (like most fans do with their team) then go elsewhere. You call it bitching or moaning but if we did not care, then there wouldn't just that-bitching and moaning and whatever you want to call it.
What is with your "hollier than thou" attitude? You come on this site with whichever ever name you decide to use and pick up "flaws" on Met fans arguments. Give me a break. Your arguments have flaws too. But you know what? Big deal. It is not about that. This isn't a debate club nor is it a technical writing seminar. Your irritating people with the way you go about your business. While you bring interesting things into this site, flattering yourself through your demeanor towards others does not strengthen your point of view if that what you are trying to accomplish.
This is a Mets-type blog we should not have to justify our ranting but we choose to. Just like you choose to have your "hollier than thou" behavior.
Who cares about Rollins so much? He plays for another team. He has made errors like the rest of them. Struck out like the rest of them. He's a good player just like Utley and a few others. The Mets won without him. Good. That's all I am going to say about that.
If I want to call Orlando Hernandez "El Dookie" I should be able to do so considering his crappy game level right now. Your the only one who cares to defend him. Good luck.
Hey Willow 13. You want some specifics for Willie? He has personally lost 3 games this year by bringing in the wrong relievers, or kept the guy on the mound too long. Secondly what mgr. does not call a single squeeze play, sacrifice or safety, in 3 yrs., esp. w/ a team that has the Met's speed? Willie is a spectator..he watches the game. He doesn't believe a mgr. can make a difference. The Mets aren't hitting..have Beltran, bunt..call for a hit and run, etc. Let Delagado hit a swinging bunt towards third to mess up the shift. He did it once last year! If he was so great for the Yanks, why didn't they tell him he would be the mgr. post Torre? Because they knew he would be a poor, non-motivating mgr. He had a wonderful career, because of the team he was on. Haven't you noticed how lethargic the team and Wiliie are? He looks like he doesn't have a clue. He will never admit that anything is wrong. He says just keep "turning the page". Last year he ran out of pages. You really think that 12 teams passed on Willie as mgr because of his race?? How many black mgrs. have there been? He's also a crybaby when he didn't win mgr. of the yr…which no one thought he deserved anyway. Put this in your diary: "THE METS WILL NEVER BE A GREAT TEAM WITH WILLIE AS THEIR MANAGER" end of story.
stanley> If you loe the mets you should give your crytal ball to the team since you know which relievers will be good and which will be bad from afar.
Second your very out of date about the squeeze. didn't you see Willie called the squeeze and the great Luis Castillo slept thru the sign and almost killed Pagan by swinging.
Have Beltran bunt? Beltran bunts and everytime he does the entire met fan base comes down on him for bunting.
Hit and run I'll grant you that one!
"If I want to call Orlando Hernandez "El Dookie" I should be able to do so considering his crappy game level right now."
I don't even know how to respond to this. He's hurt. He has no "game level" (whatever that even means.) To disparage a player because he's hurt is pretty lame.
As for my attitude, I'm not going to apologize for being able to clearly articulate my point of view in a strong and organized manner. If that comes across as being holier than thou, well, as you would say, deal with it.
Rebel, you're the one hiding behind a name, not me. My name is Keith, since birth. And educate yourself on the dynamics of the board before you get involved. Sloppy and I, as much as we quarrel, have a lot of respect for one another. I know my own personal perspective and philosophy on baseball is not the be all end all.
I simply call it as I see it. I believe the majority of the posters on this site are being ridiculous for getting all worked up over two losses in Chicago.
As for the qualifying, my point is a simple one. I've never seen a fan base that qualifies their own team's VICTORIES. Usually they qualify the losses and flaws. Instead, I've seen people say "Well, there is no way we take 4 of 6 from Philly without Rollins." Or "Ryan Church doesn't get dirty when he plays." It's like you guys are actively looking for things to complain about.
If you want to complain about Delgado. Go for it. Heilman? Fine by me (I was in attendance when he blew it in '06… so I'm not a big Heilman fan.) The Castillo signing? Dumb as hell and Minaya should be called on the carpet for it. Heck, I even understand having issues with Willie's managerial skills. But complaining about Church, Schneider, El Duque (who's not even playing), beating the Phillies 4 of 6, and losing to Carlos Zambrano is absurd.
Sloppy, here's the thing… Keith, Lenny, and Gary were GOOD. Cleon Jones was GOOD. Of course I'd take those guys on my team. They were all very good players.
Beltran talked to Reyes because he wasn't being himself. He needed to stop trying to be something he wasn't.
I think the media and the fans get caught up in this stuff too much. If you honestly believe that guys like Drew or McReynolds really don't care about winning then I think you're crazy.
An example from my own personal experience: when I played ball with my brother, I caught and he played CF. I was what you would classify as the fiery type. My brother was very laid back and calm… more like a Beltran type. But that didn't mean he didn't bust his butt every game and it didn't mean he didn't want to kick ass as much as I did. Not everyone expresses themselves on the field like Keith Hernandez or Milledge or Paul O'Neill.
Keith: I referenced Cleon as a Delgado case not a Keith Hernandez case. Cleon loafed after a ball in a very lopsided game vs Houston, and Gil made a very slow walk straight to left field and walked him very slowly back to the dugout. Jones was benched the next three games. Delgado… Today's world…. Delgado sleeps on the field… ramification NOTHING.
Hodges was also a lot smarter then Randolph in dealing with the press. He changed line-ups often like Randolph in ways that seemed to make no sense. But instead of referencing his gut, he referenced a mysterious thumb injury. The 68-71 Mets had more thumb injuries then the rest of the baseball world combined in a century..