Duque is done; Pelfrey now in
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- March
- 28
Mike Pelfrey in for the sixth and to close it out. Orlando Hernandez gave up a run on four hits in five innings. As far as the velocity issue, I’m betting the Mets will downplay it and say “he got outs.”
The Mets like to wait as long as they can before announcing decisions. With Hernandez going back to his old delivery, it wouldn’t surprise me if they wanted to see how he feels tomorrow.
If there’s no pain for discomfort, then I see Hernandez getting the job.
Pelfrey, by the way, hasn’t helped his cause by walking the first two Orioles.
This entry was posted
on Friday, March 28th, 2008 at 2:58 pm by John Delcos.
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Hmmm…let’s see…Five innings, four hits, one run, one walk.
I think this El Duque kid has sufficiently proven he can pitch a little. Maybe he’s an outside shot for the fifth spot in the rotation.
If Pelfrey sucks it up out there today, then he deserves to get thrown down in AAA and he should be forced to really earn his way back up. He's been given numerous opportunities to nail down a spot and he just keeps faltering. Personally I'm starting to think he's nothing more than a bust…I hope I'm wrong
Hernandez is our #5 until he gets hurt.
I just heard on the WFAN update that the braves have claimed
Rubin Gotay, ouch!!!!. The braves is an organization that is good seeing potential, you wonder about Omar and his people.
I also heard that register went back to the rockies.
tomg: please explain the potential of Gotay on a team that has Kelly Johnson ( a much better player )
Scott from Pelham,
I agree, johnson is a very good looking young player. I'm not saying that the mets made a bad move. It's interesting that the braves claimed him.
JD-
Has there been ANY talk (whispers, rumors, people saying Omar is "mulling it over") on the Mets pursuing anybody else outside the organization before opening day to fill the openings on the roster? I'm mainly talking about Matt Murton and/or Claudio Vargas? Vargas may be out of the picture with Duque's performance today, but Murton would seem to be available and be a BIG TIME solution to our outfield issues…
I wouldn't get crazy over El duke and Pelfrey pitching well today, the orioles are rebuilding, they stink.
Should we crazy over Big Pelf just blowing a lead and imploding for the L against the Birds' C-team?
Pelfrey did not help his cause today. Walking three and blowing the lead in a game does not help his cause. I would hope that with some additional time at NO, he would get out of this self-destruction mode he gets into from time to time.
Bill: Nothing to get crazy about. He just punched his ticket to New Orleans, not that there was any doubt he was going there anyway.
"Should we crazy over Big Pelf just blowing a lead and imploding for the L against the Birds’ C-team?"
No we should be glad. Now for sure he will go to minors and maybe he'll learn how to pitch….
As for Gotay, good for him. Being basically kicked off the bus was a classless slimy act by Omar. I'm glad someone gave him a chance.
"please explain the potential of Gotay on a team that has Kelly Johnson ( a much better player) "
the comparison is not to Johnson Scott Minaya, the comparison is to whemever he is replacing. And we lost a guy better than the roid infested piece of junk Minaya is picking up because they were buddies in Canada.
Steve: I didn't mean it literally…I was just responding to the post above saying we shouldnt take too much from Pelf pitching well against a team of backups that was mailing it in…well, he couldn't even do that.
Bottom line is that its best if Pelfrey doesnt see the majors again til September. For some reason, his first spring training/cup of coffee I remember him hitting 96, 97 consistently, and even tho he didnt use his secondary pitches as much as he does now, he seemed far more loose and effective with the FB. Now all he has is a sloppy slider that people hammer when he does throw it, and a much less effective, still unable to locate 92 MPH fastball that gets smacked around.
I don't know how you re-discover your "stuff", but he really needs to find that high 90's heater again. I think its been written a lot that he should be able to get by with "kevin brown" stuff…aka, mix in the change up every so often to change speeds, but sink the fastball and throw a 4 seamer up in the zone and you should be able to get hitters out. Drop the sloppy slider…its just never going to be a good pitch. Not everyone is meant to paint the corners and drop in sliders…Pelfrey was drafted because of his tilt and velocity, it's time to start seeing that.
Of course you are all assuming that Tatis will have the last spot on the roster. What will you all have to say when he is sent down to New Orleans.
and replaced by who scott?
The way the two pitched today your headline should read; "Pelfrey is done, Duque now in". If Dugque is sore tomorrow, the Mets should consider a different number 5 starter than these two, purely for the reason that neither one has shown consistency. Pelfrey needs guidance and Duque needs to build some strength up. I am just glad that they can ride without a number 5 starter to begin the season.
Brady Clark would be my choice.
Where are all El Duque haters now? It seems to me many people wanted to this guy to implode, so Pelfrey can make the rotation. I don't understand the logic. It seems to me that certain Met fans go all sentimental over our younger players and prospects, even when they haven't done anything to prove themselves.
I think Wright and Reyes spoiled people. Now folks think that every young guy is next superstar.
Scott-
I like Brady Clark more than most (its actually pretty irrational) and think he should be kept over Angel Pagan, who really brings very little to the table besides "athleticism" (no plate disciple, no power, doesnt hit for great avergae, very bad routes on balls and really erratic arm…but hey, the guys hitting .300 in spring training, lets make him a starter!!!), but since Pagan is a near lock to be starting, i dont know if 4 of our 5 outfielders can be guys who have less than 15-20 HR power (I know Church MAY hit more, but lets see him do it)...Chavez, Pagan and Clark have NO pop, and you really do need a guy who at least has gap power, which none of those guys do. Which is why Omar NEEEEEEEEEDS to be looking at Matt Murton. His biggest downfall is his glove, but besides Endy, its not like he'd be replacing any gold glovers on the roster. Use endy in the 9th…but Murton would fit perfect on this team.
Looking long term, it would also allow us to go cheap in the OF for next year while we wait for Fernando and invest more money in 1B and SP, where we are going to have holes.
Alas, it makes too much sense, and I just cant see Omar making this move. I'm sure hes gonna give some talk about how he "loves the guys he has" on Sunday…we'll just see when its May 1 and Pagan is playing LF like Cedeno and hitting .225
Delcos, please cut the velocity crap. It's not like ED is a power pitcher who suddenly lost 10 miles on his fastball. Guy had a 1.17 WHIP last year without ever throwing it over 88.
Bill: I think alot of it is more in his head than anything else. When he gets into trouble he has the deer in the headlights look and spirals out of control. Also I don't know where I posted it, but the Mets rushed this kid to the majors and I think it really f'd him up.
I mean, it's easy to say GET MURTON, but who are we going to give the Cubs?
Bill Shea: Lots of good points. While Clark does not hit with power. He might be a good pinch hitter. I am also thinking very short term maybe Clark is the guy from now until
May 15th when Alou gets back. Remember Pagan has options so he does not have to clear waivers. Also maybe when Castro is healthy they carry three catchers and use Castro as the right handed pinch hitter off the bench.
The last guy on the bench is going to be a very wide open spot unless someone proves to be a very good pinch hitter or until
Pagan or Church prove they can hit lefties.
Big Baby:
The cubs are ACTIVELY trying to trade him. Meaning they dont care about leverage…read the chicago sports papers or even the cubs website, there are multiple quotes from big Lou and Jim Hendry saying they are trying to find a deal so Matt can play somewhere rather than playing at AAA because he doesnt deserve that. They dont really have a lefty in their pen, so I'd say theres something they could be looking for…otherwise, minor league depth I'm sure would be more than adequate for Hendry.
If the Mets can get Murton for a reasonable package, centered around a BP guy, they have to do that. He is a huge upgrade over Pagan/clark/Tatis, and could conceivably fill a spot next year too when ALou is gone (maybe platoon with F Mart?)
Certainly hope Omar is looking at him. I expec that he is looking for an upgrade still, whether he will admit it or not, and hopefully that is the one.
The way things shook out, not getting Mench is looking like a worse idea all the time!
I would wait a little while before getting a RH bat. You always need extra pitching.
"Of course you are all assuming that Tatis will have the last spot on the roster. What will you all have to say when he is sent down to New Orleans."
I will say good, but send hi to Binghamton so you can go watch him.
Going back to Gotay on hne Braves. A very good move on ther part. He replaces Thornton who hit 80 points lower than Gotay last year. And we got a guy who is "versatile" and has had all of 50 some ABs in the last 4 years. And hit a couple Grand slams a century ago. Maybe not a Giant move to be sure, but we make our opponent a little better and we make ourselves a little bit worse.
Gotay might get a hit against the Mets but he could also come into a game and boot a couple of balls against too.
really scoopcoop: maybe, maybe maybe: Watch out maybe maybe buddy a car is driving thru your computer room, or maybe it stopped at the end of the driveway.
Your other post is correct. You do always need extra pitching, but we, the New York Mets fans and franchise do not having any of that commodity to pass around.
My point is that lots of people are assuming Gotay will somehow come back to haunt Mets. He might, but he could also help Mets by playing a ball badly.
Note from rubin in NY DN, "Ruben Gotay was claimed off waivers by the Braves, who needed a substitute for infielder Omar Infante (broken hand). The Mets dumped Gotay, likely in favor of Fernando Tatis, because the switch-hitting Gotay was inferior batting righty and had little range at shortstop."
It does not appear he was picked up as a replacement for someone who played poorly but b/c Braves lost a guy to injury.
I'm sure Glavine gave Gotay a glowing scouting report including his makeup. Nice pickup for the Braves. I hope he doesn't come back to haunt the Mets. Seems like Willie just wasn't one of his supporters. He's usually tougher on second basemen, just like he was on Matsui.
Ok Scoop, Gotay WAS claimed… by a team with an eye for young talent. What say you now?
I already pointed out that it was b/c Braves needed replacement for Infante. I never said he didn't have talent. I said that he can't hit RH or play good defense.
In fact, Bobby Cox stated the same in a statement about the pickup-good hitting LH; will use him against righties. It is quite possible that he would not have been picked up by Braves if Infante was not hurt. When Infante is available, maybe Gotay is gone, maybe not.
If Anderson was not on the team, Gotay would be. But fact is GMs and managers have their favorites and guys they don't like or are indifferent about. Willie likes Marlon. Marlon=Gotay, Gotay=bye bye.
Well, whatever the reason, for the long term success of this franchise, they better break this habit of throwing away young players with ability… even if they have uneven performance.
You could even argue that getting rid of Keppinger was a dumb move too. Dude is starting for the Reds right now. He is EXACTLY what this team needs. RH bat, plays all IF positions.
My entire point is that Gotay can't be any worse than Marlon, Tatis, etc… but he does have some potential upside.
The players you can't trade away are the stars. Neither Gotay or Keppinger are going to be stars or at least guys that can be adequate defensively while having some pop. I have not followed Kepp since he left. But when he was here, he was probably worse defensively than Gotay. You could say that Mets should not have traded Wigginton, but he was the same way-some pop, not a good glove. There are other guys like that you could point too. If you want to believe Gotay is not one of the so-so guys, you can. I don't.
One could argue pretty strongly that Mets can trade away alot of their young talent b/c my biggest issue w/Omar is that he does not have a good track record of evaluating young unproven talent (at the draft level).
The Mets farm right now is something like 28th out of 30. Even before the Twins trade, it was in the bottom third I believe.
Therefore, all the concerns people have w/these young players being traded should not be a concern b/c Mets don't have a good track record now (or just about ever in their 45+yrs) of developing young talent.
Yes, you can point to guys here and there. But, when you get down to it, the AS produced, the MVPs (none), the CYs, the HOF (1), are a very short list. And most of the players of these levels have come from outside the org.
I'm not saying this it is good to trade away young guys. It would be great if there were more DW, JR, or at least some more Heilman's.
But Mets just don't seem to be able to do this. Eventually it will come back to hurt them and they will go back into one of their down turns in their historical up and down cycles. You can't have poor player dev and be a consistent winner (unless you spend 1B/5yrs-Yankees).
Scoop, your attitude is what is plaguing this franchise. Young players who can come in and be role players have tremendous value, especially for an organization that does not produce a ton of top end talent. Guys like Gotay, Heilman, Keppinger, etc, could potentially provide league average production on the cheap, allowing the Mets to focus their considerable resources on stars like Beltran and Johan.
Scoop: you really make the case for keepoing guys like Gotay while ypou are trying to do otherwise. The fact that this system is so weak demonstrates clearly why you don't get rid of guys who are young for nothing and for nobody's.
This was a move made for very bogus reasons. Gotay's preceived wweakness vs righties and his lact of versatility.
He's replaced by a hasbeen who has no at bats, perisod, did not even earn the job during the Spring, never did anytthing for the org in the past and has no versatility. Look at his games played. when did he show it??? The answer is never. And of the 25th man is as irrelevant as some claim why give up 25 year old for a finished guy…..???
I don't consider a guy who can't play everyday or even close to everyday, as a league avg player. Your saying that the Mets would be better off having a roster filled with guys that can't hit against lefties or rigthties or can't field?
I guess you are saying then that Gotay's percieved weakness against righties is the same then as Church's perceived weakness against lefties. And it is not a preception to me that Gotay can't play multiple positions. To me, it is a fact.
It is not my attitude, it is the level of player the Mets have in their system that is the problem. The Mets have developed very little talent over the yrs, especailly position player talent. You can name the AS on a few fingers. If you can name 25 Gotays, I would be surprsied. I don't even think they have that many of the so-so bench types over the yrs. Besides, Gotay was not a Met who was developed from w/in.
It is also precieved that Gotay was left out b/c of Tatis when in fact he was left out b/c of Anderson. If Anderson was not on the team then, Gotay would be filling Anderson's role.
Tatis is on the team b/c Alou is hurt and the Mets can't be sure that Pagan can do an adequate job against lefties either (not that they can be sure that Tatis can do it either).
For somebody who complains alot about how the Mets will do poorly against lefties, having Gotay would not help the situation. Nor is having Pagan there probably going to help either.
You complain about the situational hitting, then turn around and say they should keep a guy that can't help them in those situations.
"I don’t consider a guy who can’t play everyday or even close to everyday, as a league avg player."
Did you guys not watch this team last year after Valentin went out for the year? Gotay played almost every day and played very well. What else does he have to do?
But Scoop how do you know the guy can't hit lefties. How many ABs. Did he have more than Church in the bigs? NO!!! Then your case is bogus.