Santana: The guarantees are?
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- February
- 6
Johan Santana will make the Mets better because he’s arguably one of the best pitchers in baseball. He’s an innings eater and a presence, something the Mets desperately needed.
If he gives them seven a night, that takes some of the pressure off the bullpen. Losing streaks have a chance to be cut short, a major job description of an ace.
Santana claims the Mets were a top choice, but if so this could have gotten done earlier and for a lot less. I take such boasts as posturing.
The Mets are better today than last week because of Santana, and he should make them the favorites in the NL East.
But, the Mets are a still a team with questions:
-Pedro Martinez and Orlando Hernandez have durability issues.
-John Maine and Oliver Perez are still finding their niche.
-Carlos Delgado is coming off a bad year.
-Moises Alou is a breakdown waiting to happen.
-We don’t know about Duaner Sanchez.
-There’s concern about the bullpen.
Santana makes the Mets better, but his presence raises an interesting question: How many World Series did the Yankees win with Randy Johnson? Exactly.
Negative? Perhaps. But, still the truth.
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on Wednesday, February 6th, 2008 at 8:41 pm by John Delcos.
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Very Wallace Matthews-esque.
That isn’t a good thing…
geez john. the ink is barely dry on the contract and you gotta be a total downer. We mets fans have plenty of time to worry and get negative. See september collapse. Can we just enjoy this one day?
It seems to me that RJ hasn’t pitched well since he went to the Yankees and wasn’t he just a wee bit older than Johan at the time of that trade? Not to mention that he had on and off issues with his back for a long time.
I have no idea how you can equate the two, JD. Really a stretch.
JT
JD, seriously, your yankee fan is coming out. Your going to tell me that your comparing Randy Johnson way passed his prime
in his late 30’s when the yankees got him to Johan Santana at 29 in his prime now, come on JD, Please. The other points you made are fare questions about Pedro and El Duke and Delgado and Alou and the bull pen and it is a big question mark.
You know better. RJ and Santana are not comparable—-one is in his prime and the other was over-the-hill when they traded for him. Slow news day or Mets hater?
Guys … I like it when you think I love the Yankees and hate the Mets. I love your passion, which is what fuels a blog like this.
The fair questions TomG suggests was the essence of the post.
Of course, Johnson and Santana were at different stages of their careers at the time of these deals. That isn’t the issue. But, on the day the Johnson trade was made before the 2005 season, the World Series was all but assured for the Yankees.
Don’t forget, Johnson won 17 games that year, including beating the Red Sox five times, but what did the Yankees win? That’s the point, and if you put aside your emotions for a second, you’ll realize that.-JD
John, come on – out of character post for you.
Johann has a much greater effect on this team than just his own starts…John Maine is our #4 starter! We don’t have to start a sure loser in the #5 hole. The bullpen will be used less and will therefore be able to get somebody out in September. And even how the intangible fear of having to face him a series rattles your opponent. Sad to see you so short sighted and negative when the Mets have done exactly what they needed to do.
All teams have issues. We have a lot less than most. Can we not focus on them for like 5 minutes or so?
JD
You raise some fair points. El Duque annually breaks down and Pedro just came off a long rehab just like Duaner who this group mysteriously thinks will come back and be the best reliever in the game as he was before getting hurt.
Ollie and Maine were uneven last year and faded with the team. Alou is like El Duque in that you know he is going DL. And finally Delgado has major questions regarding whether he can still bring it.
The other point you did not cover is that Santana was less than stellar at the end of the season in addition to having the well known issues that all players face in coming to The City.
All of the above is true, but this team has the players to kick the competition in the ass and go all the way. If Omar challenges the players and if Willie does what he said at the end of the year and handles the team differently we will have a different outcome.
This is a new year the Giants just won the superbowl. Hopefully what happened 21 years ago repeats and both teams taste victory in the same year.
Dave
PS
Unlike some here I appreciate your fair and honest reporting.
all valid points but the randy johnson comparsion is a little off unless you mean on how they handle new york and all that stuff.
Back in 2005 when Omar took over, everyone said we had to get Martinez and Beltran…........Omar did. Net result- we sat home and watched another team represent the NL in the world series. Then everyone said we had to get Lo Duca and Delgado. Omar did———net result…..we sat home and watched another team represent the NL in the world series. Then everyone said if we could only get Wagner…...everything would be Okay. Omar did…....net result…we sat home and watched another team represent the NL in the world series…....now everyone said…..if we could only get Johan everything will be okay…....Omar did….excuse me for not being overconfident because we picked up one player. There are many other variables and there is so much that can go wrong. Did anyone seriously think Glavine would have tanked it that bad in the last game of the season? I’m wondering whether Santana finally will help the Mets turn the corner…..or is it a case of what else can go wrong?
Good job Delcos: Maybe the comparison with Johnson wasn’t the best because he was a “Yankee”, but there are plenty of cases where bringing in a star doesn’t make you a champion.
It makes you better, which was stated in the post, it helps the pen which was stated in the post,
Minaya nade a major mistake with his egotistical statements. He should have said thagt he thinks he put together a real competitivie team that can go all the way/ But he didn’t. Now, every time a player is in a slump or is hurt questions will be raised based on Omar’s mouth, which will only make it harder. I relate his mouth to the stupid comments Bonilla made when he came to the Mets. It comes back to haunt. Can you see Omar being asked when Deavid Wrifght has a bad April now, Well, Omar, whty do you think he isn’t doing his job like you demanded? If Church can’t hit lefties and there is nobody to play for him in a platoon, I guess it wiull be Church’s fault for not lliving up to Omar’s demands.
Santana shouldn’t be a problem but you need more than one starter to make and win the playoffs. The Mets are better with him since they gave up nothing on the 25 man roster. A lot does depend on Perez, Maine, Hernandez and the cock fight fan. How can grown men take pleasure in watching animals be tortured and killed like that?
Dan Gurney,
when I read your post above I was confused why you mentioned cock fighting until I went on to espn’s website and saw and read that Pedro Martinez and Juan Marichal was on youtube showing them releasing rooster to fight one another. In there
country it’s illegal but I agree, It’s barbaric.
I meant to say in there country it’s legal.
Lots of folk here tell me I need to look at stats more to appreciate the upgrade Church is in right field, and most of you tell me what a defensive upgrade he is. So I check out church stats to gain a greater appreciation of his talents. So my question is how do you all know that he is a better Right fielder than Green/Milledge when in 2007 RYAN CHURCH DIDN’T PLAY RIGHT FIELD!!!! And in his career his primary position has been left field. So why he he such a great defensive right Fielder, or has Omar done the same thing he does with the minor leaguers? Shea Stadium is a tough place to learn a position isn’t it?
JD: STOP PLAGARIZING MY IDEAS!!!! :-)
Hi John –
The only guarantee I see in the Santana situation is the $$$$$$ that will be directly deposited into his bank account on a regular basis for lots of years…
What a deal.
I can’t remember that he was required to guarantee anything, was he?
Braves – will Hampton pitch effectively?
will Smoltz and Glavine finally give in to age?
will Chipper stay healthy?
who will replace the power of Andruw Jones?
will Francouer learn plate discipline?
will Soriano be effective and stay healthy?
Phillies – will Lidge overcome his mental block?
who will get the ball to Lidge from the starters?
will Myers be able to readjust to starting?
will Hamels stay healthy/avoid a sophomore slump?
can Rollins repeat his phenomenol year?
how will they deal with the loss of Rowand? both on the field and off.
No one has a team without questions (except maybe the Red Sox), and these are three of the best in the NL.
I’ll take my Mets and take my chances. Plus, you know that the Mets will be able to afford whichever expensive player is available at the trade deadline.
do you remember the character that rachel dratch played on saturday night live for a couple of seasons? debbie downer? the girl who could put a negative, sour spin on everything? it seems like lots of posters today are trying out for the role again.
one player guarantees nothing, of course. there is a trickle down from a player of santana’s worth. it’ll touch all of his team mates. if you don’t believe that, you understand nothing of the mets’ magic.
do you remember the character that rachel dratch played on saturday night live for a couple of seasons? debbie downer? the girl who could put a negative, sour spin on anyything? it seems like john and lots of posters today are trying out for the role again. one player guarantees nothing, of course. but there is a trickle down from a player of santana’s worth. we can just hope that it’ll touch all of his team mates. not one of us is clairvoyant. predictions are just that- predictions. upbeat ones and downbeat ones, none having more credibility than the other. superstars fade. underdogs play as if they’re superstars. if you don’t believe that, you understand nothing of the mets’ magic. for shame.
sorry bout that
I found a ‘guarantee’ which is slightly OT.
It’s a book by Frank Deford – a world class writer – called “The Entitled – A Tale of Modern Baseball”.
maybe what you all perceive as negativism is a reaction to the ridicukous over reaction to this trade, people acting like the Mets, not the Giants are the World Champions.
I guess nobody can tell me how a guy who doesn’t play right field is our great defensive right fielder…...
L we have no clue what this team will do until the season begins. and even then we wont know what they do until the end of the season. Specially after last season. sigh
we need red Leader yelling at the mets.
STAY on TARGET STAY On TARGET!
and Yoda saying. do or do not. there is NO TRY.
They need to just DO this year and not turn it on and off… god if I hear that again this year I may have to write a letter to Willie.
Steve C: And that bleepin bleepin Delgado better be better than last year!!! :-)
“and Yoda saying. do or do not. there is NO TRY.”
Wasn’t that from Karate Kid?
“Karate do, Karate no do. No Karate maybe. Understand grasshopper?”
You’re missing the point Delcos, Johan doesn’t guarantee us a World Series, anyone who thinks that is an idiot. What he does is make our TEAM better. TEAMS win championships, not players, and this guy just made our team better, meaning we’re CLOSER to winning a championship, but in no way does this guarantee anything. wake up Delcos, stop throwing wood on the fire for the sake of it.
Dave: It was Yoda
Delcos isn’t missing the point. He hit the pint square on.
Johnson was 41 and going into the harder league. Johan is 29 and coming to the easier league, so not a good comparision
johan: the point has nothing to do with age or leagues. The point has everything to do with making a trade for one superstar and the fan base being convinced the team is now champs. It happens all the time in every sport. The Suns think they are champs today because they got a crippled Shaq. The Lakers think they are champs today. The Rangers thought they were champs every time they brought in another star. Why don’t you guys get it, Johnson was just ane example of something that happens all the time…. but succeeds rarely… Maybe we win it all but this trade guarantees nothing.
TO: JOHN DELCOS
YOU ARE A COMPLETE IDIOT AND NO MET FAN SHOULD READ YOUR BLOG!
GO PUT ON YOUR YANKEES HAT!
OK, Randy Johnson wasn´t a good comparison. Is there another comparison to use? Arguably the best pitcher in baseball, in his prime, coming to a new team in an easier league in a pitcher´s park. I don´t think there´s a valid comparison.
Does Santana make the team better? Yes.
Are there still questions? Yes.
Are we guaranteed a postseason berth? No.
Will we be competitive and a good bet for a postseason berth? Yes.
Another thing. It´s very popular nowadays to say that Pedro has durability issues. I don´t think there´s any basis to assume that. In 2006 and 2007 he was bothered by injuries. Those injuries have been corrected by surgery. It´s as valid to say that he will make 30 starts as it is to say that he has durability issues. Certainly the taste we had in September was impressive. You could argue that the surgery and the rest will make him more effective, in spite of his age, than he was in 2004-2005.
How many Cy Young awards are on the staff now?
To Henry: Thanks for checking in. Come back again when you have something to add to the table.-JD
Dave in Spain: Would Frank Viola in 1989 count? I don’t think the AL was perceived as stronger back then but it was a trade of a top pitcher to the non-DH league. I remember listening to Pete Franklin on WFAN (before Mike and the Mad Dog!) heartily endorse that trade. Everyone did.
You could also at the HGH twins-Pettitte and Clemens-moving to Houston in 2004 although that is a bandbox. Same thing with Randy Johnson to Houston, then Arizona in 1998.
dave in spain; when you have major surgery, your durability is a very valid question, and you probably forgot but Pedro had a bad foot that could not be corrected by surgery. One flare up of the foot and the whole process starts over. He pitched with bad form to compensate for the foot. How can anyone say his durability is not an issue. And why wasn’t the Johnson trade a good comparison. The guy had a great year his first with the Yanks and they didn’t win.