Mets Chat Room
Good day. We all know on this homestand the Mets fell out of the ugly tree and hit every branch on the way down. They are off today to lick their wounds and give Ramon Castro a day to heal.
I just posted a new poll on the Mets’ worst off-season move. Post your thoughts here and vote.
Of course, this is your Mets Chat Room, so any and all topics are welcome. Thanks. Enjoy the day.
Print This Post
| 
Advertisements
Only 3 games up on Philly. We need to start off this road trip on the right foot. After an off day I couldn’t bear to watch Green out in RF. We need some life. Milledge needs to be out there.
Willie could at least give him a chance to fail. But he doesn’t even do that. Milledge gets 2 hits on Saturday night, where is he on Sunday? The bench.
Milledge has put up very good numbers batting 8th most of the time, where he doesn’t see great pitches, and doesn’t have a chance to steal bases, and now he is not even going to play consistently. He is 12-for-28 in August. Play him.
I really like Shawn Green but he has been lousy since his good start. He’s not helping them too much. I keep hoping he’ll regain his form but something tells me that he is just through. Milledge is much better player right now. Thats really what it comes down to. The manager is supposed to put out the lineup that gives the team the best chance to win the game and Willie is not doing that. It doesn’t matter what the reason is, its bad.
I voted “Mota” but Schoeneweis was just as bad a move…
But if I could’ve added my own, I’d’a voted Heath Bell for Ben “AAAA” Johnson.
Most of the other problems are about how Willie has used the players not about what players Omar gave him to play with… or about injuries that no one in the organization could be blamed for.
Reyes, Wright, Milledge, Gotay, a healthy Gomez and a healthy Beltran are the core position players of a great team for years to come and…
If they’re all healthy, Delgado, Alou and LoDuca all have a year or two left in them as solid veteran support guys.
Perez and Maine are a great tandem, a healthy Pedro is still an ace on most teams, El Duque and Glavine are still crafty dudes.
Wagner Sosa Feliciano Heilman is a solid solid front end of the bullpen and Sele has grown into an acceptable but not spectacular long reliever.
If you use this team properly, it has all the talent in the world… on paper, it’s the best team in the NL by a length and a half.
But if you’re pretending that Green is an everyday starter, that Anderson is a centrefielder, that Gotay should ever sit against a rightie, that David Newhan belongs on a major league roster…
If you’re using Schoeneweis or Mota in non-mop-up situations…
It doesn’t matter if you have all the talent in the world, if your manager continues to bench them and start guys who were stars in 1996.
Some of Willie’s moves can be questioned as can all managers’ moves. But Omar gave him a seriously flawed team to work with, especially the bullpen. It was Omar who had Franco on the team wasting a roster spot and he was the one who signed an injury prone Alou and traded for Green last year. Sorry but you can’t make a silk purse from a sow’s ear. OK, so the 2007 Mets aren’t exactly a sow’s ear. But they certainly aren’t a silk purse.
Omar had a really bad winter. I just hope he has a better one this year. They need to resolve the catching issue and I don’t see either Lo Duca or Castro as the fulltime answer. They need to resolve 2nd base, maybe let Gotay start out the season as the starter but have a more proven veteran in the wings should Gotay revert to the mediocre hitter he was in the minors and with KC and should his defense hurt the team. He has his work cut out for him and I’d hate it if he looked to fragile over-the-hill veterans like he did last winter.
Counting on Mota and Schoenweis to shore up the bullpen, letting Bradford go after how successful he was for the Mets all year long and in the postseason, was by far the worst move of Omar’s year and NY Met regime so far.
And by the way, if they do not take at the very least 5 out of 6 from the Pirates and the Nationals, i’ll be very upset. There is no excuse not to.
I guess my thing with Gotay is simply… he’s still young enough where this might not be a fluke, it may be things finally clicking.
He’s probably never going to be a great hitter against lefties and… he’s certainly not going to hit .340 forever…
But if he can hit around .300 with good power for a second baseman and some speed… that’s more than enough out of that position.
And I do think he’d be capable of that.
I’d keep around a veteran middle infielder to possibly hit against tougher lefty pitching, though, sure.
Personally, if LoDuca’s healthy, he’s still great behind the plate and… I’d take him next year, as long as Willie bats him eighth and accepts that any offense out of him is just gravy.
A lot of teams use their catcher like that, the Mets can too… I think we were just spoiled by having Piazza for so long.
This year, you had to have ONE veteran corner outfielder around… Milledge and Beltran should’ve been playing from the start but Gomez wasn’t ready to play everyday yet…
But having Green AND Alou is completely ridiculous, yeah.
Alou wasn’t the mistake, though, I have to believe Green was. Dude can still rake when he’s healthy, it’s just that he’s not always healthy.
Alou as your third outfielder with Gomez and Chavez both as insurance plans would’ve been a fine idea, with Beltran and Milledge as the other two.
Green’s the one that’s the headscratcher.
second base and catcher are the primary offseason concerns? lol! How about building a bullpen, and getting some offense from the corner OF’s and 1B?!! I think those are much bigger problems to be solved.
Honestly the personel on this team are ok enough, they are underachieving. No, Omar didnt put together a 100 win team, but they shouldnt be scuffling their way to 85 wins either. Its on them to do it, they need some life, a spark. Its as though they are waiting for Pedro, waiting for the playoffs to start. Get to it, now!
and now they have a worse record thatn the Yankees. puke
Omar made a mistake by trading for Green in 2006. There was no way he could unload Green after 2006 without eating his contract. So at that point they are wedded to Green for 2007. So what does he do? He puts another oldtimer in left field. There already was a declining veteran in the outfield. Why make it two? He just compounded his original mistake. Anytime you pay a player $8.5 million and get only about 40 RBIs from him the entire year, that’s a mistake.
Here’s the problem with Lo Duca. He can’t hit anymore. He can’t throw anymore. And it will probably get worse next year. They need to start looking for younger solutions. It was idiotic to leave Flores unprotected.
Schoeneweis…you got to be kidding…its not mota…cuz mota can at least get somebody out…Schoeneweis 3 years 10 mil..could have been well spent on bradford or somebody else….he sucks. much worse than mota
The thing about Schoeneweis, is that he not only represents a bad move for this season, but maybe for two more. ... And, I agree with playing Milledge more. Why bench production?-JD
Omar has done a brilliant job as GM. Lets all remember how piss poor this team was prior to Omar’s arrrival as GM. One can question any and all moves at any point. There are zero guarantees. The fact of the matter is that as this team is assembled it should be playing 20 games above 500. They are under-performing and that is not Omar’s fault. The fault lies with the players themselves.
To Pete B.
While that’s true, let’s not forget that a lot of those under performing players were brought in by Omar.-JD
J.D…it’s because Willie’s preference is to play the Vets over the Kids.
JD: Green has a higher batting average against righthanders than does Milledge since the All-Star break. Are you saying that doesn’t count for anything? Willie has been starting Milledge in RF when there is a lefthander starting. So I can’t quibble with what he’s doing. Don’t you think it’s important that no one goes stale on the bench? If he benches Green permanently which is what you are suggesting, then essentially Green becomes useless. If you feel he’s useless anyway, then Omar should just release him. Then it’s an Omar issue.
Pete B: If the players are underperforming because they are old and on the decline, then there’s not much anyone can do about it. And it’s Omar’s responsibility for acquiring so many older players. I know some disagree, but I believe Alou, Green, Valentin, Delgado and Lo Duca all underperformed this year because they are all past their prime. You can’t turn back the clock on these players.
To JK:
I DID NOT say Milledge for Green straight up fulltime, but that he should be playing more. There’s a difference.
I would like to see a regular rotation to give him his at-bats and keep everybody fresh. Resting Green, Alou and Beltran at least once a week would mean three starts a week.-JD
JD: Ok, sorry. It’s just that Willie has already been platooning Milledge with Green in RF. Milledge has already been getting about 3 starts a week—or even more. Whether that holds up now that Beltran is back remains to be seen. But it just sounded like some were pounding Willie over Milledge when Milledge has already been getting plenty of playing time.
Well, in fairness, Rocky Horror seems to have done a good job of hiding his leg injury until well after he got signed… so the organization probably isn’t completely at fault if they fell for that.
The fact that Mota was a ‘roider and was going to drop off when operating legally was of a public record to all.
Guys hiding their injuries until after the big contract… that’s sadly a part of the game of ball.
But Mota, they should’ve just known with him.
The Mets have offense from the outfield corners… Milledge is surging into form and, frankly, I think the sanest thing to do next year would be to protect Beltran’s health by moving him to a corner once Gomez is ready to be an everyday starter.
And whether we like it or not, whether he’s injured or not, Delgado’s the starter until his contract runs out.
With Delgado, I just hope maybe his elbow will actually heal this off-season and he’ll have one good year out of him.
The outfield: I’ll go to war with Beltran, Milledge and Gomez for the next ten years, man. Have Chavez around as a back-up, eventually F-Mart gets in there? I feel set in the outfield.
The infield: Reyes and Wright for a long damn time, maybe Gotay for a long damn time but keep A-Hern around as a late-inning defensive replacement and then…
Yeah, in NEXT year’s off-season, evaulate what you can do at first.
The bullpen is iffy this year but… if Sanchez and Burgos are healthy and Smith is seasoned? That’s a money bullpen. Omar just has to have the balls to DFA Mota and only use Schoeneweis for mop-up.
The starting rotation? Maine and Perez are anchors, Pelfrey will be good enough for the back-end of the rotation soon, throw in the last good year for Pedro and El Duque and that’s a rotation that’s more than good enough.
Catcher?
Yeah, catcher’s a big question mark for next year but properly used, LoDuca’s probably good enough and then hope the 2009 market is better?
The 2007 off-season needs are catcher and one #3-type starter.
The 2008 off-season needs will probably be a first-baseman and maybe another middle of the rotation pitcher.
Mota, until getting suspended for juicing, pitched brilliantly for the brief while he played for us last year. Letting Bradford go and signing Schowenweis was a horrible decision; I loved the Bradford/Feliciano combo so much last year and something died inside me when I found out it was gone. But Omar did admit that he didn’t realize how much pitching was going to cost this offseason, and he initially felt he could get a good MRP for less than what Bradford went for. He signed Showenweis because the market looked slim and he was trying to cut his losses.
And Wagner asked Willie last year to use Bell more when it came around August/September and we had that 7 game lead. Billy wanted to be rested for the postseason, knew Bell had good stuff, and wanted to see him get a shot. So, while I usually don’t blame Willie, he should have used Ring and or Bell more last year to find out what they were made of. Just like he loves using his “guys” this year. Unfortunately, his guys seem to be two years and three early bird specials away from the senior citizen’s home.
But…can we all just appreciate that, were the Mets to have (basically) this same exact team four-five years ago, we would be unstoppable! Oh yea! Let’s time travel back to 2002, grab a light beer, flip to SNY, and enjoy watching Delgao, Green, Alou, Beltran and Castillo mauling every other team while Glavine, El Duque, and Pedro (who, surprisingly, is in perfect health and high spirits!) pitch lights out back-to-back-to-back. Omar Minaya for GM of the year! ...just not this year
Schoeneweis had a lousy ERA last year and in previous years. There’s certainly no way to hide that. And if his leg was a problem, how come he was able to pitch OK on the road at the same time he was terrible at Shea? Because of that, I can’t see how his leg was problem.
this team needs “mr. softy” carlos beltran, and “bounce one to first” carlos delgado to start picking it up, milledge needs to be playing somewhere, preferably right field, with shawn green getting one or two starts a week in right, and milledge the rest…this team just needs some fire to their ass*s and start playing with some f*cking urgency because this isnt f*cking 2006..the braves and phillies are improved, and are right there, at 3 and 3.5 respectively…willie needs to show some fire, flip some f*cking tables, get these guys playing with some fire and some urgency!
I cannot believe wat Mike C wrote. He did not, repeat did not blame Willie Randolph for all the injuries. Mike you’re wrong its Willie’s fault for not moitoring the stretches.
Its even Willie’s fault when it rains.
Next Mikey every player that signs a contract has to undergo a physical prior to finalization of contract. Why the heck didn’t Willie find that injury?
Bring back the Art Howe regime. Now there was a man who could inspire a KC Royal tyoe performasnce out of the team. Man do I miss those 100 loss seasons, don’t you Mikey C?
And you could have added a new category in the poll.
Does it make you feel good Danny to call Mets players nasty names? Did you miss the nursery school bus this morning?
As I said in another post, I can’t see how one could cry over a reliever with a 5.00+ ERA not getting a chance to close. But if you want to cry, go cry about Rick Peterson. Apparently, Peterson and Bell had their issues. It was Peterson he didn’t get along with. Go to the link below and listen to the interview he did with Somers on WFAN on 7-17. That’ll tell you all you need to know about Bell’s problems with NY. Willie wasn’t an issue.
http://www.wfan.com/pages/744540.php
Upping Willie’s contract. By far the worst move.
i dont see how so many ppl are voting bell and ring for johnson…first of all it was bell and ring for johnson and adkins…second…a straight up ring for adkins is fine…both guys suck alot….johnson is injured and hes not bad….bell’s injured too…so this is an irrelevant trade…
JK mentioned in the last “chat room” that the Pads had Ring in the minors; he was traded to the Braves (somehow) at the deadline, then they put him in the minors.
I wish there was a way to get Mota off the team, but it seems like Omar has trouble sucking it up and admitting mistakes. I can’t think of a situation where he has done that so far, besides maybe obvious points of dropping Lima, Park, and other crappy spot starters. Hopefully, when Smith is ready to return, or Burgos has found something, one of them can take Mota’s spot. It has to be before September 1, so that player can be eligible for postseason though, unless of course a reliever gets DLed by the end of the regular season.
I’m still pretty hopeful of making the playoffs because the other teams have just as many flaws as we do. And on that road trip, the team showed up like they were back to good play. Another great road trip would do us well, like 5-1, especially with the Pirates coming off this doubleheader today.
By far the worst move of the offseason was signing Barry Zito to 7 years $126 million. Oh wait, that wasn’t us…
If resigning Guillermo Mota to 2 years $4 million, or whatever, is the worst move, then you’ve had one helluva successful offseason. Sidestepping landmines (read: signing Zito, trading Milledge) is AS IMPORTANT AS that big offseason signing.
I think the worst move made was the one he didn’t do. How could Omar NOT re-sign Chad Bradford?
A great righthanded setup man who like Feliciano proved he can pitch in a big city like New York (look at what Gagne’s doing lately) He was tough on hitters much like Turk Wendell from back in the day, got the much needed ground balls to induce double plays and yielded very few home runs.
Why was Schoenweiss so attractive when Bradford asked for the same amount of time and proved he could pitch here?
When was the last time Met fans approved of their manager. If you say Valentine you lie because nobody understood the millions of moves he made. If you say Green you lie because he was driven out of town. Torborg. The worst manager ever. Had a championship Marlin team in the cellar before he was dumped. Howe. We won’t even discuss. Buddy, Everyone said he didn’t make the right moves and favored “his” guys. Sound familiar??
Maybe Davey, we loved him in 86 but then as the veterans aged he favored them as well. sound familiar? Most said Yogi sucked even though he got us to the playoffs. You all would have hated Gil becuase he platooned as much as he could and you all would be bitching about a kid not playing every day. Westrum?? Stengel?? The talent was so bad it didn’t matter. We even had a bum named Joe Frazier and we had a novice named Torre that you all thinks sucks in the Bronx.
so what credibility is there when every manager is hated??
JD: Why don’t you have a poll as to who Omar should make manager if he’s listen to all these Willie bashers?
And for the poll, it’s hard to choose because most of them have turned out awful, but I chose Bannister, especially due to my own expectations at the time. I thought Bannister allowed too many runners, especially with walks, and granted that he got out of so many jams, was just not doing too well. Burgos could have been the high-speed guy out of the bullpen, maybe pushing Mota off the team when he returned, but he didn’t grab the opportunity. At least Mota and Schoen are still in the majors, as bad as they do sometimes, while Burgos is useless to the Mets right now. I cant fault trading Bell and Ring because it was mostly about getting them off of a team where they weren’t being given a chance and give them a try somewhere else, just to be charitable to them. With the way Bell has turned out, it’s too bad we didn’t get a major league player back for him.
Spiderpig, a week before the Padres traded Ring to Atlanta, they sent him to the minors. That’s how much they thought of him. Forgot that he had been traded to the Braves, but it’s interesting to note that with all their bullpen woes, they’ve kept him in the minors too.
Bell was given 46 innings to pitch for the Mets in 2005, and 37 innings last year. In both years his ERA was over 5.00. How many more chances did he deserve? Also, what GM is going to give away anything of value for a reliever who just put up two lousy years in the majors?
Look at what Bell did this year; he was told he would be given a spot on the team, and has performed very well. On the Mets, each year those innings had to be over four different stints, so it’s not like he was given much of a consistent workload in the majors, while closing games pretty well in the minors, if I remember correctly. I didn’t blame them for the trade though, just in hindsight we lost, with the players we got back.
shoenweiss is lefthanded…lefties make more than submarin’ righties haha
Chris, don’t be fooled. Counting on Mota and Schoenweis to be staples of the pen was a HUGE mistake by Omar. Don’t underestimate this.
If Bell couldn’t perform even in limited duty with the Mets, then it’s questionable if he could perform given a bigger role. You see how little patience Mets fans have now for failed relievers or a player like Pelfrey. I doubt they would have had any more patience for a floundering Bell.
And since Peterson didn’t like him—or at least that’s how Bell perceived his relation with Peterson—then it’s questionable if Bell could have succeeded with the Mets no natter what his role was as long as Peterson is the pitching coach. Maybe it was this belief, real or perceived, which made Bell pitch so poorly for the Mets.
Can’t credit Willie with playing Milledge more because of the injuries. He really had no choice. Over the past four games, Milledge has started one. One of those games, Marlon actually started over him. The real test comes now with Alou, Beltran, and Green available. He’s got to find a way to play Milledge, not only for the lineup but for help in the outfield. When a fly ball pitcher like Ollie is on the mound it hurts to have Green and Alou both out there.
Heath Bell was not going to succeed in NY. It’s that simple. He needed to go somewhere to chill and SanDiego was that place. He was the quintisential AAAA player for the Mets and that’s all he would have become.
By the way, further to what I said about the bullpen being a crapshoot on another post, Dotel was placed on the 15 day DL this afternoon.
Maybe the mistake was not giving Bell more of a chance. But I tend to agree with those who say that Bell is much more comfortable in San Diego and that helps account for his success there. I have a hard time believing he would replicate in NYC what he’s done this year.
Since there was no guarantee that he was going to make the Mets’ 25-man, I can’t argue too strenuously with the trade. Bell was out of options and it made sense to get something rather than nothing for him. On paper, Johnson made a certain amount sense because he is regarded as having genuine 4th OF potential.
I don’t whether Ring, Owens, or Lindstrom all had options, but, even though the trades right now look like the Mets got the weaker end of the deal, since none of those guys were going to make the 25-man, it’s hard to see why those trades make a huge amount of difference.
I understand why people think that not signing Bradford was a mistake. But the real mistake is signing Schoeneweis for three years. What middle reliever in his 30s should get three years? Middle and setup relief is always a crapshoot, guys have great years and then terrible ones. Bradford is always an injury risk because of his back and his motion. So not meeting Bradford’s demands for three years doesn’t bother me, but panicking and giving Schoeneweis does.
seriuosly Delcos, take the stick our of you no where. We all know all you know how to do is rip on the Mets, great job. You are the all mighty prognositacotor of all that should be done in the game of baseball. No bad moves, ever! Our team, our GM should be making the best moves at all possible times and never, i say NEVER have them backfire! Oh yeah, we should be winning the world series every single year, or at least reaching the NLCS every single year. Oh yeah, all the other good teams do that every year, so why can’t the Mets? Oh wait, all the other good teams in the league are consistently good every single year so why can’t the Mets? What’s up with that? The Mets are so lacking right now, they couldn’t find 1st place if it smacked them upside the head. Either way, None of those moves are make or break moves, bottom line. None of them. Middle relievers are a crapshoot, and don’t pitch enough important innings to decide a team’s fate, and thats the bottom line. And frankly, Bannister simply WOULD NOT BE A STARTING PITCHER FOR THIS TEAM. Ok, maybe by now he would be, after injuries, slumps, what have you. But who is to say that he pitches like he is in KC the same way he would pitch here? John Delcos says he would…so it must be true…
Huh? Bradford has been a model of consistency and health throughout his major league career. You’d be hard pressed to find a middle reliever who’s been as consistent as Bradford. This is his 9th major league season in which he’s pitched at least 10 innings. In 7 out of those he’s had an ERA below 3.30. In the other 2, his ERA was 3.86 and 4.42—still better than what Schoeneweis and Mota have so far put up. And Bradford has pitched most of his career in the AL with the DH. Further, he appears to have been injured only once in his career, in 2005 when he pitched only 23 innings and put up the 3.86 ERA.
It’s not a crapshoot with all relievers, and then some relievers are more of a crapshoot than others.
metsfan, what’s your problem? Delcos is just giving an opinion here and there just like the rest of us. If you want to go traipsing around in a field of daisies all day wearing rose-colored glasses this is not the place to do it. Zip it. Leave us be so we can have a civil and intelligent discussion about the Mets without your making ridiculous personal attacks.
And you’re right. There’s no telling how Bannister would do if he pitched this year in NY. But seeing how it’s more difficult to pitch in the AL central division, I think he’d have even better numbers with the Mets.
Word is Carlos Beltran’s oblique tightened after his at-bat Sunday from the right side. No pain, just tightness.-JD
Remember, Chad Bradford has a history of back problems. I can understand why they did not give him 3 years. 3 years is a long time for relievers who are notoriously streaky/injury risk. But I can’t for the life of me, applying the same logic, understand why they gave 3 years to Schoenweis.
What I can’t remember is, who else was on the free agent Market, besides Bradford, who would have been an upgrade?
When did Bradford have a history of back problems? Is it this year where he’s racked up 42 innings so far? Last year when he pitched 62 innings? 2004 when he pitched 59 innings? 2003 when he pitched 77? 2002 when he pitched 75? Seriously, I’d like to know.
Apart from 2005, there’s doesn’t appear to be any year in which Bradford had any serious health issues.
These back issues appear to be more myth than reality.
“Word is Carlos Beltran’s oblique tightened after Sunday’s at bat”...I hate to be a voice of doom but are we going to see this for the next four years?
Signing Mota was the morally reprehensible move of the off season. Trading Bannister for Burgos was the most perplexing.
Favorite Met manager? Probably Davey Johnson. He was smart enough to give Wally Backman a chance. Worst? Jeff Torborg. Randolph? Above average. I think he sets a professionalism in the dugout which is important. With the Mets resources as baseball’s second richest franchise, that is sufficient.
August ‘04 – Bradford to DL with back strain
March ‘05 – Bradford had back surgery
Here’s a some info for ya JK. Read it and you wouldn’t fault Omar for not giving him 3 years. His delivery is an issue for him healthwise. ”...Once you have a back problem, you have a back problem (forever).”
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2005838
Of course, if Omar gave him the deal and he was only good for 2 of the 3 years I could have lived with it.
What is the deal with Sanchez – I keep hearing he will be back this year – Does anyone have a recent update on this guy and is it unrealistic to expect anything out of him this year?
JR: Right. I already mentioned 2005. And in 2004 it was just 2 weeks that he missed. So apart from that limited period of time for 2005 and part of 2004, he’s been able to pitch without any issues. His low ERA all the other times is testament to how well he’s been able to overcome any back issues.
If anything, last year should have convinced the Mets that Bardford was basically healthy. Randy Johnson had back surgery when he was younger and he was able to overcome his issues for many many years until recently when age got the better of him. But Bradford is just 32. Age shouldn’t be a big issue for him through the end of his current contract.
I’m confident that the Orioles will get at least 2 good years out of Bradford. Tbe way I figure it, if a team gets good performance out of a free agent for at least 2/3’s of the life of the contract, then it is worth it. I’d rather sign a player with slightly risky health issues (Pedro is an example) but is high quality rather than one who is firmly mediocre but has no known health issues (Schoeneweis).
Also, I don’t think I ever read where health was the barrier to signing Bradford. The reason given at the time was that they just didn’t want to go that high in terms of dollars. The length of the contract was not the sticking point. So I don’t think the Mets had real concerns over his back.
a few things:
I was busy this weekend and only caught the games on highlights. BUT WHY DOES DELGADO turn it on when its too little to late and still make himself look clutch? where was he the previous games? sigh
LoDuca and Castro Both hurt?! ugh….
sigh
i got it. lets put Castro at 1st. get a replacement for Loduca until he gets better….
since we dont care about a good fielding 1st basement and need a bat it makes perfect sense…. at least castro is consistent with the bat wink*wink
JK: I had read that his health was why they didn’t want to go three. And while I can understand that I agree with you totally about getting 2/3 of performance.
In fact, to touch upon something that Dan said before, the Mets are one of the high payroll teams. That is an advantage they need to continue to use. A big market, high payroll team can absorb getting 2/3 on a contract. And on a contract like that, they won’t be hamstrung later. They need to use that payroll to their advantage and not get out bid on players that can actually help them. I get not signing Zito. I actually think the Mets weren’t that high on him in NY, put a number on his worth and stuck with it. But paying someone like Bradford a little more wouldn’t have been in an issue, bad back and all.
JR: I looked up an old New York Times article where it talked about the Mets and Bradford, and they did mention that the Mets didn’t want to go more than 2 years. Though they didn’t mention health concerns, maybe that was a part of it. Here’s what else the article said:
“Bradford allowed only 10 of 53 inherited runners to score, the sixth-best percentage among qualifying relievers, according to Stats Inc., and induced 3.18 ground balls for every fly ball, the fifth-best mark.
As well as Bradford pitched during the regular season, his value skyrocketed during the postseason, when Randolph consistently relied on five or six relievers to bail out a rotation decimated by injuries. Bradford pitched in seven of the Mets’ playoff games and did not allow a run in five and two-thirds innings.”
Wow, how do you replace that? Even if Bradford weren’t as good this year as last, he would have been better than Schoeneweis or Mota.
Mel, you are a f*ggot…take your head out of your *ss…you know im right, every little injury beltran gets, he misses a lot of time…hes a primadona…and delgado is so unclutch its not even funny…be realistic, the team has no urgency, and better find some motivation fast before its too late
JK: Thanks, I’m glad some here sees the huge value of Bradford. On a side note, just the other night when Wagner was about to implode with the bases loaded against the Bravos, I was really thinking, “Wow, what ever happened to Bradford?”
Just the other week I recall hearing Gary or someone in the booth reviewing the BP’s ability get groundball outs and it’s ain’t very good. Granted Wagner pulled out a miracle.
Bradford & Feliciano reminded me a lot of Cook & Wendell. If you look at Bradford’s stats he hasn’t allowed 1 HR all season long in his 47+ innings pitched. I sure as heck was thinking of him when the mets bullpen seemed to be yielding grand slams every other week.
I definately had to vote for trading Ring and Bell for Johnson. There was no need for another outfielder who looks like he should be playing for the Jets. Meanwhile Heath Bell has become a premier reliever in baseball, while our bullpen continues to struggle with Mota.
Well the Mets did think they had their ground ball specialist in Joe Smith. I think they overestimated his readiness, and that clearly was a mistake. Now that he has been sent down Mota is getting more time in the 7th inning, and that is a bad thing. Hopefully Smith will get his head straight and be able to come back and help.
I think it’s silly that “re-signing Mota” is winning the current poll as the Mets’ biggest off-season move. First off, he was cheap. He’s been a quality reliever, and despite what you’d think, he hasn’t pitched that poorly this season. Sure, he has stunk in some unfortunate spots, but he has also been one of the few unlucky pitchers on the Mets’ staff (using DIPS, BABIP, LD% – I won’t bore you).
The real bullpen blunder, in my opinion, was letting Bradford go and then signing Scott Schoeneweis, who had basically 2 good weeks for the Reds to vouch for him, to the same contract that Bradford wanted. Schoeneweis has actually been lucky this year, too, and he still has been terrible. As a LOOGY he’d be suitable, but 3 years/10.8 million for a LOOGY?
That and trading Heath Bell, whose peripherals were teriffic. I’m sure Mr. Minaya (or someone with some sway in the Mets’ organization) is familiar with the art of analyzing pitcher performance by more than W/L, ERA, and ‘how the guy looked,’ so I think letting him go was probably more of a confidence thing, i.e. he’ll never succeed in New York. I don’t know what to say to that except, we’ll never know.
The Mets are making a big mistake every day they don’t release Shawn Green outright.
Please, bore us with specific stats showing how unlucky Mota is. I’d love to see them. I don’t think you’ll find any solid ones. He isn’t unlucky. Just bad. And he’s not cheap. He’s owed over $3 million dollars next year. I’d like to see Omar eat that.
Mota-Bradford-Schoeneweis have to be looked at as a whole in the sense that a decision about one of them probably affected the others.
I know it’s fashionable for some to trot out BABIP stats for Bell to try to make a case that he was unlucky, but guess what? He was unlucky two years in a row in NY. So even if you believe in BABIP and luck, at some point you have to concede that his luck just wasn’t going to change in NY. But more important, to me, is that he had a rocky relationship with Peterson. That in itself is reason enough to get rid of Bell. If he wasn’t going to get along with Peterson, then it probably wasn’t going to work out for him in NY no matter what his BABIP was.
JK, I found this good analysis of the Mets’ pitching:
http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/fantasy/article/analysis-of-the-pitching-for-my-ny-mets/
Blastings, thanks for the link. I took a look at it but the writer’s conclusions don’t seem to square with his data. First let me say that for the most part, given large sample sizes, I do not believe in BABIP and the concept of luck. Luck may play a small part in a particular game or series of games in terms of their outcome, but in terms of a pitcher’s main stats, I don’t think luck is a significant factor (again, as long as there is a sufficient sample size). But putting that aside, Mota’s BABIP is .290. That is considered about average. The only Met relievers who have very high BABIP numbers are Sele and Smith.
If you believe Carty then you’d also have to believe that the main reason Feliciano is having a good year is because he’s lucky. I don’t subscribe to that either.
I just want Mota off of this team. I don’t think he’s going to get any better, luck or no luck.